Geoff Kilpatrick Posted November 28, 2018 Share Posted November 28, 2018 14 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said: Governance proposals are here - first PDF https://www.foundationofhearts.org/governance/ I chortled when they mention a "fit and proper" test for directors. If Dave King is "fit and proper" so is anyone! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davemclaren Posted November 28, 2018 Share Posted November 28, 2018 15 hours ago, iainmac said: So, for a minimum of 1 year's contributions, the pledger retains the right to vote on key matters whether they are / are not pledging at the time of said vote? I'd say that's a major concession on the original proposal and a clear sign that suggestions from here and elsewhere have been taken on board. I agree. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davemclaren Posted November 28, 2018 Share Posted November 28, 2018 15 hours ago, iainmac said: So, for a minimum of 1 year's contributions, the pledger retains the right to vote on key matters whether they are / are not pledging at the time of said vote? I'd say that's a major concession on the original proposal and a clear sign that suggestions from here and elsewhere have been taken on board. I agree. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Albert Posted November 28, 2018 Share Posted November 28, 2018 16 hours ago, 132goals1958 said: I would hope it might encourage some to get back on board with their pledges. I doubt if the original governance proposals caused any significant number to cancel their DDs. The evidence on here is that you can count the number interested in governance on the fingers of two hands, if not one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Albert Posted November 28, 2018 Share Posted November 28, 2018 17 hours ago, Footballfirst said: The following proposal seems a bit "wordy". The Foundation will not have a right to direct the Club as to how funding from the Foundation should be spent. That will be a matter for the Club board and management to decide. However, where it is clear that Foundation members would like to see funds used for a particular purpose, their views will be communicated to the Club Board by the Nominated Directors. The Nominated Directors will report annually to the members of the Foundation on how the contributions have been used by the Club. I interpret it as FOH can't tell the club where they want FOH contributions spent, but they can ask, although the final decision lies with the club. There is no indication of when, how, or how much FOH funds will be transferred to the club, e.g. monthly, on request from the club, or as FOH sees fit, regular or variable amounts. There is still no limit on the amount of pledges that FOH may retain for internal use. This (the wordy bit) seems OK to me. The principle of separation of FoH and club board roles is right and important. I'd expect communication from the Nominated Directors not only on how the funds were spent but also on the reasons why FoH's preferences were (if they were) over- ruled. There should also be some consultation about members' preferences before the Nominated Directors communicate FoH's views. Isn't the fall back FoH power, if the club board rejects FoH's preferences without good reason or justification, not to re-elect them at the (club) AGM or put a motion forward at the AGM to remove them? It should never come to that but a useful power to ensure it doesn't! I agree there should be definition of how, when, and with what deductions, members' contributions are passed to the club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainmac Posted November 28, 2018 Share Posted November 28, 2018 43 minutes ago, Francis Albert said: I doubt if the original governance proposals caused any significant number to cancel their DDs. The evidence on here is that you can count the number interested in governance on the fingers of two hands, if not one. There was a decent debate on here but the Governance proposals went out via various platforms (email / Twitter / FB etc) and responses had to be sent in via a specific email address so maybe more people went down that route? I certainly did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Albert Posted November 28, 2018 Share Posted November 28, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, iainmac said: There was a decent debate on here but the Governance proposals went out via various platforms (email / Twitter / FB etc) and responses had to be sent in via a specific email address so maybe more people went down that route? I certainly did. I didn't mean to suggest that the JKB thread (which FoH quotes as an important source of feedback) was the only source of comments. Merely that the level of responses on here (and even more so the level of remotely critical responses) did not suggest there have been many (if any) cancellations of subs as a result of the proposed draft governance arrangements. That may be wrong - maybe you have better information? But to get back to a positive note I was pleased that FoH invited and gave an email address for AGM questions from members unable to attend. I may have missed it but the club does not seem to have done the same for shareholders in relation to its AGM. Edited November 28, 2018 by Francis Albert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Kilpatrick Posted November 28, 2018 Share Posted November 28, 2018 I'm also pleased that calls for "special directors" are far more transparent, as opposed to going through existing directors' business connections. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Albert Posted November 28, 2018 Share Posted November 28, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said: I'm also pleased that calls for "special directors" are far more transparent, as opposed to going through existing directors' business connections. I am not sure I see where this is covered, though I may be missing something or some earlier step. As far as the FoH Board is concerned the changes seem to be -increase from maximum 6 to 7 members - always a majority of non-specialist directors - the Chairman must be non-specialist if there is an even number of Directors and Chairman thus has a casting vote. These changes cover a concern I raised about the scope for the FoH boad to be controlled indefinitely by a "clique". For the club board there will (once ownership is transferred) be a nominations committee to advise on the appointment of the Chief Executive and a non-executive director, This committee will include the two FoH Directors on the club board. I don't see any provisions making calls for specialist directors ) on the FoH board more transparent or subject to any more objective test or scrutiny. But I may be missing something. Edited November 28, 2018 by Francis Albert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted November 29, 2018 Share Posted November 29, 2018 A 'Working Together' document setting out the relationship between the Foundation and the Club is still to be developed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted November 29, 2018 Share Posted November 29, 2018 (edited) Another vote will take place on the changes to the Foundation Constitution required by the new governance arrangements as they are implemented over the next 18 months when majority ownership transfers. This vote, or Resolution will allow amendments to be made if necessary though any major changes will be voted on. Edited November 29, 2018 by Mikey1874 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott herbertson Posted November 29, 2018 Share Posted November 29, 2018 21 hours ago, Francis Albert said: I am not sure I see where this is covered, though I may be missing something or some earlier step. As far as the FoH Board is concerned the changes seem to be -increase from maximum 6 to 7 members - always a majority of non-specialist directors - the Chairman must be non-specialist if there is an even number of Directors and Chairman thus has a casting vote. These changes cover a concern I raised about the scope for the FoH boad to be controlled indefinitely by a "clique". For the club board there will (once ownership is transferred) be a nominations committee to advise on the appointment of the Chief Executive and a non-executive director, This committee will include the two FoH Directors on the club board. I don't see any provisions making calls for specialist directors ) on the FoH board more transparent or subject to any more objective test or scrutiny. But I may be missing something. Thanks for that summary - those are positive changes and good to see that notice is being taken of people's concerns Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Albert Posted November 29, 2018 Share Posted November 29, 2018 5 hours ago, Mikey1874 said: Another vote will take place on the changes to the Foundation Constitution required by the new governance arrangements as they are implemented over the next 18 months when majority ownership transfers. This vote, or Resolution will allow amendments to be made if necessary though any major changes will be voted on. When you say "this vote" do you mean the one at the upcoming AGM? I wondered about this because, unlike more detailed draft governance proposals consulted on earlier the latest document is merely an outline. The devil is in the detail as they say and things like (for example) the process for selecting candidates for specialist director positions (which was covered in earlier versions) seems to be missing from the latest document. I also wonder how "major changes" are defined. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Findlay Posted November 29, 2018 Share Posted November 29, 2018 Sorry been busy when is the FOH Agm? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Albert Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 (edited) On 29/11/2018 at 22:34, John Findlay said: Sorry been busy when is the FOH Agm? 6pm, Wednesday 19th December.C (Club AGM the day before at 11am.) Edited December 1, 2018 by Francis Albert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Findlay Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 4 hours ago, Francis Albert said: 6pm, Wednesday 19th December.C (Club AGM the day before at 11am.) Thank you. Sadly miss both due to work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nelly Terraces Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 (edited) . Edited December 1, 2018 by Nelly Terraces Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted December 7, 2018 Share Posted December 7, 2018 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballfirst Posted December 7, 2018 Share Posted December 7, 2018 I was speaking to Stuart Wallace tonight at the youth cup tie, but decided that it wasn't the right place to ask him about governance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davemclaren Posted December 7, 2018 Share Posted December 7, 2018 34 minutes ago, Footballfirst said: I was speaking to Stuart Wallace tonight at the youth cup tie, but decided that it wasn't the right place to ask him about governance. I bet he was relieved. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballfirst Posted December 7, 2018 Share Posted December 7, 2018 32 minutes ago, davemclaren said: I bet he was relieved. ? He was more interested in talking about his early years as a referee. In fact there were quite a few refs and ex refs in the crowd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted December 19, 2018 Share Posted December 19, 2018 On 27/11/2018 at 17:51, Footballfirst said: Updated Governance proposals, to be voted on at a General Meeting to be held immediately following AGM Find out soon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted December 19, 2018 Share Posted December 19, 2018 Vote announced this evening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
132goals1958 Posted December 19, 2018 Share Posted December 19, 2018 99% carried Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted December 19, 2018 Share Posted December 19, 2018 1 minute ago, 132goals1958 said: 99% carried Yeah. There you go Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted December 19, 2018 Share Posted December 19, 2018 In black and white Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
132goals1958 Posted December 19, 2018 Share Posted December 19, 2018 The two seeking re-election won convincingly but I am pleased the guy I voted for is going to be involved in some capacity Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jambali Posted December 19, 2018 Share Posted December 19, 2018 What a boring meeting though... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davemclaren Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 2 hours ago, jambali said: What a boring meeting though... What were you expecting? ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainmac Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 7 hours ago, davemclaren said: What were you expecting? ? Police in attendance, chairs flying, stink bombs..... Just the usual stuff. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Treasurer Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 24 minutes ago, iainmac said: Police in attendance, chairs flying, stink bombs..... Just the usual stuff. ? If nothing else, the pieman did make AGM's that wee bit more interesting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainmac Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 31 minutes ago, The Treasurer said: If nothing else, the pieman did make AGM's that wee bit more interesting That type of "excitement" we can all do without these days. Boring AGM's are actually a good thing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Treasurer Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 1 minute ago, iainmac said: That type of "excitement" we can all do without these days. Boring AGM's are actually a good thing! Agreed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davemclaren Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 2 hours ago, iainmac said: Police in attendance, chairs flying, stink bombs..... Just the usual stuff. ? I’m sure there was a fight outside after one agm as well. I prefer quieter events to be fair. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jambali Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 10 hours ago, davemclaren said: What were you expecting? ? I've been to many a boring AGM, but this one was exceptional!! These guys do a great job, but The opening speech was waaaaay toooooo loooong. Votes had already been decided. Business of both meetings could have been done & dusted in half an hour. I made sure I attended because the board were concerned about being inquorate, won't make that mistake again!! On a positive though - the Mincemeat pies were good!! ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davemclaren Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 3 minutes ago, jambali said: I've been to many a boring AGM, but this one was exceptional!! These guys do a great job, but The opening speech was waaaaay toooooo loooong. Votes had already been decided. Business of both meetings could have been done & dusted in half an hour. I made sure I attended because the board were concerned about being inquorate, won't make that mistake again!! On a positive though - the Mincemeat pies were good!! ? I found the opening speech fine though maybe could have done with some slides to illustrate the key points. Great view of the stadium. The ‘grass lights’ enhance it a lot. Worth going for that alone but it’s important that members stay actively involved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballfirst Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, jambali said: The opening speech was waaaaay toooooo loooong. Votes had already been decided. Business of both meetings could have been done & dusted in half an hour. I agree. The purpose of an AGM is to review the performance over the reporting period and to look forward, not look back over several years. Noone can be unaware of the clubs administration and the Bidco/FOH agreement that achieved a CVA. Noone is denying that the club and FOH has come a long way in the last four and a half years, but there is no need to repeat that history at every AGM. 1 hour ago, davemclaren said: I found the opening speech fine though maybe could have done with some slides to illustrate the key points. Great view of the stadium. The ‘grass lights’ enhance it a lot. Worth going for that alone but it’s important that members stay actively involved. Dave - It was a great view illuminated by the "grass lights", so much so that I was minded to take a pic. Edited December 20, 2018 by Footballfirst Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davemclaren Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 14 minutes ago, Footballfirst said: I agree. The purpose of an AGM is to review the performance over the reporting period and to look forward, not look back over several years. Noone can be unaware of the clubs administration and the Bidco/FOH agreement that achieved a CVA. Noone is denying that the club and FOH has come a long way in the last four and a half years, but there is no need to repeat that history at every AGM. Dave - It was a great view illuminated by the "grass lights", so much so that I was minded to take a pic. Beautiful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott herbertson Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 On 28/11/2018 at 13:11, iainmac said: There was a decent debate on here but the Governance proposals went out via various platforms (email / Twitter / FB etc) and responses had to be sent in via a specific email address so maybe more people went down that route? I certainly did. I did too, and in fact the revised proposal is quite close to what I suggested in my email message. So I’m happy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott herbertson Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 2 hours ago, Footballfirst said: I agree. The purpose of an AGM is to review the performance over the reporting period and to look forward, not look back over several years. Noone can be unaware of the clubs administration and the Bidco/FOH agreement that achieved a CVA. Noone is denying that the club and FOH has come a long way in the last four and a half years, but there is no need to repeat that history at every AGM. Dave - It was a great view illuminated by the "grass lights", so much so that I was minded to take a pic. A fantastic picture Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lfhearts Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 Magical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davemclaren Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 56 minutes ago, scott herbertson said: I did too, and in fact the revised proposal is quite close to what I suggested in my email message. So I’m happy. I attended and voted for the proposal. However, I expressed concerns over FoH funds just being subsumed into general income as opposed to having specific uses, particularly for infrastructure type projects. To be fair it was virtually the same point I made a year ago and Ann and Alex Mackie’s responses were virtually the same as they made last year as well. It’s good to see consistency from us all. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7628mm Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 1 hour ago, scott herbertson said: A fantastic picture I did suggest to someone else looking out on the pitch that I may pop out and top up my tan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Albert Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 The revised proposal is not what I wanted but meets about half of my concerns so there it is - water under the bridge now. Would that Remainers and Leavers could enter into things with a similar appetite for compromise! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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