Another Mass Shooting in America

[tian447]

So the coward is the guy who didn't fancy getting killed by a lunatic, and not the people who refuse to change the gun laws, or the person doing the shooting in the first place?

[Eldar Hadzimehmedovic]

Maybe Trump should ditch his entire security detail for him and his family and he can just carry a shotgun in his pocket instead. 

[gjcc]

Trump just announced new sanctions on N.Korea. Where's their right to bear arms? Kim should amend the constitution asap. 

[The White Cockade]

38 minutes ago, gjcc said:

Trump just announced new sanctions on N.Korea. Where's their right to bear arms? Kim should amend the constitution asap. 

just a deflection from the  news at home

[Sharpie]

1 hour ago, doctor jambo said:

Would not say this guy was a coward, not by a long stretch. Though the public who have  not been confronted with their own death will probably damn him as such.

you cannot know how you would respond in a real shooter scenario

 

 

I mam afraidf I have to disagree with you quite strongly. This man was in a position for which he was specially trained. He was nine years in that position must have made relaionships with staff and pupils, he probably had a straight day shift job weekends off, and was winding down to retirement. H was faced with a traumatic experience, for which he had been trained, no one asked him to be a hero or to be brave, all he was asked was to fight his fear, and do what he had sworn to do. He decided that his life was more important than the victims and made a decision not to do his sworn duty, in my book that was an act of cowardice.

 

With reference to your second comment, from my life experiences I know exacxtly how I would react, in the vernacular I would be scared shitless, but know full well that I would rather fight my fear of and accept the possible than live being seen in my own eyes and those of my colleagues as someone who did not do his duty.

 

As a nineteen year old in Egypt I was on an escort to an Egyptian driven delivery van, when detailed we were adv ise that very recently two paratroopers had been murdered by activists, our orders were if any deviation of route occurred we were to warn the driver, tell him three times to stop and get bac k to the route  and failing to do so he would be shot.  Just like clockwork my driver deviated off the pescribed route, and when ordered smiled and laughed and gave me the O.K Jock routine, i got to the third warning cocked my sten gun, and pointed under his chin, and simultaneously arrived in a village with a large number of people gathered, I was going to go down fighting when I realised it was a happy group, and backed off, and sat there whilst the driver received his parcel of fish. Scared of course I was going to run and hide, not in this life.

 

As a constable in the Edinburgh Police I was delegated one day to sit in a cell with a man who had murdered his wife.  This man was well known as violent, and brutal, he  had been recently convicted of assaulting a barman from a famous Leith Street pub, after knocking him to the ground he had deliberately set out to blind the man by gouging his eyes.  Here I was in a locked basement cell of the old High Street headquarters, no contact with the upstairs people, just me and a killer, who gouged eyes. Was I afraid you bet I was, was I going to beg out and have someone else do the dangerous task, not at all.

 

So before you question how I would feel in the situation the Deputy was in, and ask if I know how I would react, I give you two examples and could provide a couple of others, even at eighty three years of age  I would rather fight than run.

[John Findlay]

25 minutes ago, bobsharp said:

 

 

I mam afraidf I have to disagree with you quite strongly. This man was in a position for which he was specially trained. He was nine years in that position must have made relaionships with staff and pupils, he probably had a straight day shift job weekends off, and was winding down to retirement. H was faced with a traumatic experience, for which he had been trained, no one asked him to be a hero or to be brave, all he was asked was to fight his fear, and do what he had sworn to do. He decided that his life was more important than the victims and made a decision not to do his sworn duty, in my book that was an act of cowardice.

 

With reference to your second comment, from my life experiences I know exacxtly how I would react, in the vernacular I would be scared shitless, but know full well that I would rather fight my fear of and accept the possible than live being seen in my own eyes and those of my colleagues as someone who did not do his duty.

 

As a nineteen year old in Egypt I was on an escort to an Egyptian driven delivery van, when detailed we were adv ise that very recently two paratroopers had been murdered by activists, our orders were if any deviation of route occurred we were to warn the driver, tell him three times to stop and get bac k to the route  and failing to do so he would be shot.  Just like clockwork my driver deviated off the pescribed route, and when ordered smiled and laughed and gave me the O.K Jock routine, i got to the third warning cocked my sten gun, and pointed under his chin, and simultaneously arrived in a village with a large number of people gathered, I was going to go down fighting when I realised it was a happy group, and backed off, and sat there whilst the driver received his parcel of fish. Scared of course I was going to run and hide, not in this life.

 

As a constable in the Edinburgh Police I was delegated one day to sit in a cell with a man who had murdered his wife.  This man was well known as violent, and brutal, he  had been recently convicted of assaulting a barman from a famous Leith Street pub, after knocking him to the ground he had deliberately set out to blind the man by gouging his eyes.  Here I was in a locked basement cell of the old High Street headquarters, no contact with the upstairs people, just me and a killer, who gouged eyes. Was I afraid you bet I was, was I going to beg out and have someone else do the dangerous task, not at all.

 

So before you question how I would feel in the situation the Deputy was in, and ask if I know how I would react, I give you two examples and could provide a couple of others, even at eighty three years of age  I would rather fight than run.

Bob sadly we don't make them as much in Britain/Scotland today as you, me and thousands of others of certain generation.

[OTT]

13 minutes ago, bobsharp said:

 

 

I mam afraidf I have to disagree with you quite strongly. This man was in a position for which he was specially trained. He was nine years in that position must have made relaionships with staff and pupils, he probably had a straight day shift job weekends off, and was winding down to retirement. H was faced with a traumatic experience, for which he had been trained, no one asked him to be a hero or to be brave, all he was asked was to fight his fear, and do what he had sworn to do. He decided that his life was more important than the victims and made a decision not to do his sworn duty, in my book that was an act of cowardice.

 

With reference to your second comment, from my life experiences I know exacxtly how I would react, in the vernacular I would be scared shitless, but know full well that I would rather fight my fear of and accept the possible than live being seen in my own eyes and those of my colleagues as someone who did not do his duty.

 

As a nineteen year old in Egypt I was on an escort to an Egyptian driven delivery van, when detailed we were adv ise that very recently two paratroopers had been murdered by activists, our orders were if any deviation of route occurred we were to warn the driver, tell him three times to stop and get bac k to the route  and failing to do so he would be shot.  Just like clockwork my driver deviated off the pescribed route, and when ordered smiled and laughed and gave me the O.K Jock routine, i got to the third warning cocked my sten gun, and pointed under his chin, and simultaneously arrived in a village with a large number of people gathered, I was going to go down fighting when I realised it was a happy group, and backed off, and sat there whilst the driver received his parcel of fish. Scared of course I was going to run and hide, not in this life.

 

As a constable in the Edinburgh Police I was delegated one day to sit in a cell with a man who had murdered his wife.  This man was well known as violent, and brutal, he  had been recently convicted of assaulting a barman from a famous Leith Street pub, after knocking him to the ground he had deliberately set out to blind the man by gouging his eyes.  Here I was in a locked basement cell of the old High Street headquarters, no contact with the upstairs people, just me and a killer, who gouged eyes. Was I afraid you bet I was, was I going to beg out and have someone else do the dangerous task, not at all.

 

So before you question how I would feel in the situation the Deputy was in, and ask if I know how I would react, I give you two examples and could provide a couple of others, even at eighty three years of age  I would rather fight than run.

 

You're obviously really experienced with this stuff so not questioning that as there is no question the officer shat the bed big time. It does though highlight the ridiculousness of the situation. There is always a chance if one person is put in charge of the entire schools safety in this kind of event that they will fail to act appropriately - Perhaps if there had been two they'd have been able to suppress the fear because they wouldn't want to let their partner down? I think its important not to allow the officers failure to do his job detract from what happened as i'm sure plenty from the pro-gun lobby will want to turn him into a scapegoat. Ultimately, someone who should not have got a gun, got a gun and killed a lot of people (again).

 

You've actually kinda highlighted something I've been thinking about for a while. I think there is a massive difference to police officers who come from an army background to those who come from a civilian background. I'm not sure quite what it is, but those from an army background from what i can gather tend to be better at handling dangerous situations - perhaps the live combat that they've seen makes them a lot more desensitised to a live shooter so can react more effectively. Theres a guy called Michael Woods Jnr (former marine and Baltimore cop) i'm sure he said something about not having to fire his weapon on duty before and then contrast that with any one of the various black guys who have been killed for what appears to be no reason by cops. Its not black and white and i'm sure theres examples of the opposite happening but the experience and years of training must surely make those from an army background more effective in dangerous situations. Regardless, I'd be interested to know the officers background, civilian or army.. What do you think?

 

Moving on, I think it shows America's gun laws haven't adapted with the times. I have a feeling we might finally see the change that failed to come after Columbine, Virginia Tech and Sandy Hook - As well as the many more between them. I don't think we've seen before kids hold politicians to account for their inaction and conflict of interest (with who they take money from -NRA, and their responsibility to act in the best interests of wider society). It might not be far enough reaching change but if it can curb the massacres then it would be a good start. 

[Eldar Hadzimehmedovic]

This notion that men prove their courage and manliness by fighting, engaging in gun battles where the odds are ludicrously stacked against them, and walk unflinchingly into death. I just can't get behind that all. It archaic and insane. 

[Sharpie]

3 hours ago, Barack said:

Are those who freeze in War Zones cowards?

 

Have they not suffered some PTSD? Shell shock? When is it ok to alleviate a member of the Armed Forces for refusing to fire, as opposed to a Policeman?

 

Food for thought.

 

Anyway, suppose a teacher, “trained” of course, has the chance to shoot a suspected assailant(could happen in DT’s Dystopia...) and freezes? 5 children could’ve been saved. Is that teacher then a coward? Should they be pillioried in National press too?

 

Guy’s had the decency himself to resign, and  to realise he’s not acted in the manner he knows he should’ve & his role expects. 

 

There’s enough blame going around, without making that poor ****er a scapegoat, for years of inactivity by political parties.

 

He resigned when he was or was about to be suspended, he has also taken retirement, one suggestion was that he had thirty years service, nine of which were straight days in a comfortable environment preparing for retirement.  Sure there is blame to be attributed, lots of it many from police, to F.B.I politicians not many exempt from responsibility, as a police manager I actually find it hard to believe that again we have the did nobody notice that Deputy Peterson is mebbe getting too comfortable and complacent actually again and in my case a different generation but nine years in that kind of detail is a long time.  Again its only me and I am just an old fart spouting, but Iwould rather have gone into the school after the shooter than ever have to face one of the parents of a 14 year old who was killed while I against all orders, policy, and training remained in comaparative safety.  I just cannot imagine what kind of retirement it coul be if on a trip to Vegas or somewhere in conversation you are identified as the cop who didn't go in.

[Sharpie]

11 minutes ago, Eldar Hadzimehmedovic said:

This notion that men prove their courage and manliness by fighting, engaging in gun battles where the odds are ludicrously stacked against them, and walk unflinchingly into death. I just can't get behind that all. It archaic and insane. 

 

 

Actually a general responded to this last night and I agree totally with him, men  fighting in battle or in the subject circumstance are not really brave or courageous they have fought their fear to do what had to be done, and I really know how that feels, sure you are scared but you have to overcome , and of course a high level of training, and practise does increase your confidence in being able to do what you have to.

as John Finlay says we are from a different generation, if I came home with a bleeding nose and a couple of bruises after a fight, my old man wouldn't care if I won or lost, if I came home unmarked and said I had backed down, I would get the smack I should have taken.

Edited February 23, 2018 by bobsharp

[peter_hmfc]

Various companies cutting ties with the 'Ra (NRA), I actually have a feeling some real changes will be made as a result of the shooting.

[Shanks]

I'm starting to think bobsharp might be James bond.

[John Findlay]

5 minutes ago, Longshanks said:

I'm starting to think bobsharp might be James bond.

Retired.

[Watt-Zeefuik]

Would that "death before dishonor" was a mantra of American police. In most cases it is officially "to serve and protect" but what I hear officers say to each other is "get back home safely."

 

The US military has its own problems but I have a huge amount of respect for soldiers, while I have lost most of my institutional respect for American police. The military continues to teach honor, discipline, and restraint, while US police forces have become the repositories of people who couldn't make it as soldiers. Honestly soldiers have far more official constraints on their activities in war zones than police do in the streets, so people who got frustrated that they couldn't just go around shooting everyone they thought of as "bad guys" left the military and joined their local PD.

 

That's not to say by any stretch all police are like that. But I have met far more bad cops than I have bad soldiers (though I've met some of those too).

 

My cousin's husband has been a Green Beret, an Army Ranger, and special forces. He's now a Colonel in the reserves and also a history professor. He looks like the nerdiest guy you've ever seen -- I'm talking coke bottle glasses -- but he's undoubtedly one of the bravest people I know.

 

Anyway, sorry to ramble, but school resources officers are often the repository of lazy bullies on the force who want a cushy job. 

Edited February 23, 2018 by Ugly American

[Zico]

4 hours ago, Eldar Hadzimehmedovic said:

Mental that the guard is being hung out to dry by his superiors. I should know better by now but sometimes the lack of compassion and downright insanity in that country still takes my breath away. He's basically being called a coward because he didn't martyr himself. 

I think he’s being criticised because he didn’t do the job he was paid to do, while unarmed, 15 year old kids tried to do that job. That being said, it’s a convenient distraction for the pro-gun lobby and will help deflect from the real issue. So not good all round. 

[Maple Leaf]

4 hours ago, John Findlay said:

Bob sadly we don't make them as much in Britain/Scotland today as you, me and thousands of others of certain generation.

People like you, Bob, and me have served in the Armed Forces, and I think that that experience instils a different set of values compared to people who have not donned the Queen's uniform.  I'm not saying that those values are better, but they are different.

 

 

[Sharpie]

36 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

People like you, Bob, and me have served in the Armed Forces, and I think that that experience instils a different set of values compared to people who have not donned the Queen's uniform.  I'm not saying that those values are better, but they are different.

 

 

 

No doubt about  it ML , I entered the Guards Depot a seventeen year old boy, guys I went to school with graduated fifth year about the same time I had spent 12 weeks learning in an ultra strict environment drill, deportment and discipline.  I followed this with thirteen weeks of training in infantry weapons and tactic skills, and shortly after left to go to Egypt on Active Service. My time in the army impressd on me the importance of loyalty, and the importance of duty. I saw once on Facebook a guy ask about an ex guardsman, he was told quite strongly that there is no such thing there are only guardsmen who are no longer serving. That training and experience stays with you and is still in me. It got me through my police career, and many aspects of life. The only thing I have never learned is when to stop, not realising that people are not criticising me, just that our lives have been so different. Probably a bit late to learn but I will try

[John Findlay]

44 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

People like you, Bob, and me have served in the Armed Forces, and I think that that experience instils a different set of values compared to people who have not donned the Queen's uniform.  I'm not saying that those values are better, but they are different.

 

 

I understand exactly what you are saying however, and I am sure you have experienced it over there in Canada. There has, how I put it. A slipping of standards right across society.

[redjambo]

(Forget it)

Edited February 23, 2018 by redjambo

[Jambo-Jimbo]

United and Delta Airlines have now joined a growing list of companies to sever ties with the NRA.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-43181337

 

[ri Alban]

On 23/02/2018 at 23:19, John Findlay said:

I understand exactly what you are saying however, and I am sure you have experienced it over there in Canada. There has, how I put it. A slipping of standards right across society.

Why don't big hard as feck Bob, Maple and yourself go and offer to protect America then. Going by your posts the Avengers should bring you out of retirement(Steve Rogers could do with a few mates his own age).

A shriveled dick swinging contest of posts.

Edited February 25, 2018 by ri Alban

[Beats]

[Jambo-Jimbo]

3 hours ago, ri Alban said:

Why don't big hard as feck Bob, Maple and yourself go and offer to protect America then. Going by your posts the Avengers should bring you out of retirement(Steve Rogers could do with a few mates his own age).

A shriveled dick swinging contest of posts.

 

  But if you are then and 

 

Not covering yourself in glory there Aussie, imo that is.

 

[ri Alban]

2 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

  But if you are then and 

 

Not covering yourself in glory there Aussie, imo that is.

If that's your opinion, that's fine, you as they say are entitled to said opinion. We obviously don't come to the same conclusion from the attitude shown to another persons in the moments state of mind. I certainly don't see bravado as some sort of weapon to use against someone. The human psyche is one delicate thing and on another occasion roles may have been reversed. I have no idea what sort of life situation this cop was experiencing.

[The Internet]

4 hours ago, ri Alban said:

Why don't big hard as feck Bob, Maple and yourself go and offer to protect America then. Going by your posts the Avengers should bring you out of retirement(Steve Rogers could do with a few mates his own age).

A shriveled dick swinging contest of posts.

 

Excellent rant. 

[Seymour M Hersh]

5 minutes ago, Mauricio Pinilla said:

 

Excellent rant. 

 

Deranged rant might be more accurate.

[The Internet]

22 minutes ago, Seymour M Hersh said:

 

Deranged rant might be more accurate.

 

Deranged rants are the best rants. 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

23 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

37 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

 

If that's your opinion, that's fine, you as they say are entitled to said opinion. We obviously don't come to the same conclusion from the attitude shown to another persons in the moments state of mind. I certainly don't see bravado as some sort of weapon to use against someone. The human psyche is one delicate thing and on another occasion roles may have been reversed. I have no idea what sort of life situation this cop was experiencing.

 

There are multiple reports that Scot Peterson the Broward Sheriff's Deputy at the centre of this row may not have been the only Broward Sheriff's Deputy who failed to enter the school and engage the shooter.

It is reported that up to 4 Sheriff's Deputies from Broward Police Department were outside the school when the Coral Springs Sheriff's Deputies arrived and it was they who entered the building to engage the shooter, whilst the Broward Deputies still remained outside, but by this time the shooter had already fled.

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/02/23/politics/parkland-school-shooting-broward-deputies/index.html

https://globalnews.ca/news/4045895/florida-school-shooting-police-officers-failed-to-engage/

https://www.newsday.com/news/nation/florida-shooting-scot-peterson-1.16927795

https://nypost.com/2018/02/23/four-sheriffs-deputies-hid-during-florida-school-shooting/

And numerous other links all reporting the same.

 

So Scot Peterson may in reality just be the fall guy and is being hung out to dry to try and deflect from a larger failing on behalf of the Broward Police Department.

In time the truth will out, that I'm sure of, but if the above reports are true then that puts a completely different slant to the story because someone had to be in charge of these 4 Deputies and what orders were issued and by whom, or did the 4 of them just decide not to enter the school themselves, as said the truth about this will come out.

 

[Mac_fae_Gillie]

20 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

There are multiple reports that Scot Peterson the Broward Sheriff's Deputy at the centre of this row may not have been the only Broward Sheriff's Deputy who failed to enter the school and engage the shooter.

It is reported that up to 4 Sheriff's Deputies from Broward Police Department were outside the school when the Coral Springs Sheriff's Deputies arrived and it was they who entered the building to engage the shooter, whilst the Broward Deputies still remained outside, but by this time the shooter had already fled.

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/02/23/politics/parkland-school-shooting-broward-deputies/index.html

https://globalnews.ca/news/4045895/florida-school-shooting-police-officers-failed-to-engage/

https://www.newsday.com/news/nation/florida-shooting-scot-peterson-1.16927795

https://nypost.com/2018/02/23/four-sheriffs-deputies-hid-during-florida-school-shooting/

And numerous other links all reporting the same.

 

So Scot Peterson may in reality just be the fall guy and is being hung out to dry to try and deflect from a larger failing on behalf of the Broward Police Department.

In time the truth will out, that I'm sure of, but if the above reports are true then that puts a completely different slant to the story because someone had to be in charge of these 4 Deputies and what orders were issued and by whom, or did the 4 of them just decide not to enter the school themselves, as said the truth about this will come out.

 

Assuming that the 4 other deputies were there it would be logical to wait for them before entering the building on his own. as he must have known the support was nearby. For 1 person to enter the building with zero intelligence on what was going down knowing you got 4 guys in support near by is pure daft. In logic he should circle the building access and report as soon as the others showed up. Of course if he didn't know support was close by then he was pretty much under standing orders to go in.. as for him been a coward, shit + motion + fan = fear. Fear and letting fear control your actions is not exactly cowardice it could be just obeying common sense.AS a shooter you make everyone a target. as a cop entering you got to access who is a target gives the shooter the edge, only having backup gives you the edge.

[ri Alban]

1 hour ago, Seymour M Hersh said:

 

Deranged rant might be more accurate.

Maybe I should just brag about how tough I am with gun. Then I might be deranged.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

11 minutes ago, Mac_fae_Gillie said:

Assuming that the 4 other deputies were there it would be logical to wait for them before entering the building on his own. as he must have known the support was nearby. For 1 person to enter the building with zero intelligence on what was going down knowing you got 4 guys in support near by is pure daft. In logic he should circle the building access and report as soon as the others showed up. Of course if he didn't know support was close by then he was pretty much under standing orders to go in.. as for him been a coward, shit + motion + fan = fear. Fear and letting fear control your actions is not exactly cowardice it could be just obeying common sense.AS a shooter you make everyone a target. as a cop entering you got to access who is a target gives the shooter the edge, only having backup gives you the edge.

 

Overwhelming force and all that springs to mind, but we don't know what actually happened, what the circumstances were, hopefully all this will come out in the ensuing investigation.

 

And lessons are learnt, if they need to be.

 

Edited February 25, 2018 by Jambo-Jimbo

[Sharpie]

I am man enough to accept the  criticisms laid on me, I am the first to admit that I get carried away with my past, its really all; i have, my future time is indeterminate.

 My rather harsh judgemnt of the Deputy was based I am sorry on my experience.  My  information came from the mouth of the Sherrif of Broward County who stated  quite clearly that he wa sick to his stomach by the videoed lack of action by his Deputy who had now resigned , and would retire.  The Deputy had been videoed outside the school for four minutes while the shooting was occurring. it has been stated frequently on broadcasts here, that persons such as the Deputy who was conducting his full time, trained for position as  School Resource officer, basically armed security in case of such an incident.  Since the Columbine shooting the mandate for persons in that position is that immediately they should proceed to the scene, don't call for backup, don't stop to assist injured, go forward and confront the shooter. That seems reasonably direct, but I am sure there will be a reason for inaction presented

Actually I am not a hard man, I am quite a caring individual, and as such I cannot imagine myself failing to do what I was mandated to do when adults and children I had got to know over nine years were sc reaming, shots being fired, and obviously kids especially being killed. I know I yack on about my training and if you care to read some of my old posts recently I stated that I have become what I hated as a young man an old fart ranting on about his past, as I also say my past dictated by almost brainwashing that I react in a certain manner under given circumstances, this I am sure would have been one.

Again I have to go back to my own time, in the police service I saw on numerous occasions older policemen being given a job to get them out of the way because they were not interested in police work they were busy planning retirement, thats fine, but if thats what you want don't take a job where you may get in harms way and and have to act, but thats just my thinking.

I am sorry I have upset so many people, I don't know who you are , nor what you do, you have certainly been free with your insults and I commend your courage, I know evenif you witnes violence you will stand up and at least give a witness statement, the may even allow you the anonymity of an alias .

On Saturday morning seeing how the tide was running I signed out, of Kickback, knowing these posts were coming, but then who I am kicked in and I decided I was a better man than that. Throw your best I believe I can handle it.

 

Edited February 25, 2018 by bobsharp

[milky_26]

trump  would have ran into the building unarmed if he was there

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/43202075

[Cade]

Donald Trump seems to think he's Chuck Norris now.

 

It'd be hilarious if he wasn't 100% being sincere.

[Joey J J Jr Shabadoo]

12 minutes ago, milky_26 said:

trump  would have ran into the building unarmed if he was there

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/43202075

It's a shame he shat himself during 'Nam.

[Sharpie]

The lawyer for the Deputy has just been on TV making a statement.  His first statement is that Peterson refutes claims that his action was cowardly. I guess I wasn't the only one who seen it so. He goes on to say that Peterson was responding to what he thought was firecrackers. He then thought the shooting was outside so he took cover and prepared in a tactical manner. No harangue from me one wee question what were you taking cover from, would a person not  proceed to the source of the shooting then take cover, but what do I know.

 

What is a tragedy in this whole thing is that careers from FBI, to police to politicians have all been ruined, some quite deseverdly so. Some adults and some beautiful children died, some survivors will live with emotional mental, and physical injuries that will last for the rest of their lives. Meanwhile the real cause of the problem is sitting in jail, being cared for, and his punishment will be to do so for the rest of his life.

[Boab]

14 minutes ago, milky_26 said:

trump  would have ran into the building unarmed if he was there

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/43202075

 

I wish he had.

[All roads lead to Gorgie]

Run into the building Donald

[Jambo-Jimbo]

Run into the building would he, thought he had heel spurs, oh I forgot he only had them to beat the draft, and he has the nerve to call other people cowards.

 

[peter_hmfc]

41 minutes ago, Joey J J Jr Shabadoo said:

It's a shame he shat himself during 'Nam.

 

He shat himself at a rally in Nevada when NO-ONE was armed but someone shouted the word.

 

"US Republican presidential candidate Donald Trump has been hustled off stage by security agents at a rally in Reno, Nevada, after someone in the crowd shouted "gun" during a scuffle with a man who held up a "Republicans against Trump" sign."

 

 

 

 

Carry on charging down that heavily armed 19 year old on an AR15-inspired rampage though.

 

I'm getting sick of referencing the Curb Your Enthusiasm theme now.

[Boris]

5 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

Run into the building would he, thought he had heel spurs, oh I forgot he only had them to beat the draft, and he has the nerve to call other people cowards.

 

Just heard this on the radio. What a trumpet! 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

27 minutes ago, peter_hmfc said:

 

He shat himself at a rally in Nevada when NO-ONE was armed but someone shouted the word.

 

"US Republican presidential candidate Donald Trump has been hustled off stage by security agents at a rally in Reno, Nevada, after someone in the crowd shouted "gun" during a scuffle with a man who held up a "Republicans against Trump" sign."

 

 

 

 

Carry on charging down that heavily armed 19 year old on an AR15-inspired rampage though.

 

I'm getting sick of referencing the Curb Your Enthusiasm theme now.

 

And he shat himself again here.

 

 

[The Real Maroonblood]

1 hour ago, milky_26 said:

trump  would have ran into the building unarmed if he was there

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/43202075

[Maple Leaf]

I despise Trump.

 

Having said that, in the videos where he is being hustled off the stage by his security team, he probably didn't have much choice.  Their job is to protect him, and if they felt that there was a threat to his safety, they would get him out of the way as quickly as they could.

 

The Secret Service got a major black eye with the JFK assassination, and I believe that they now take no chances.

 

He's still a pathetic piece of human trash though.

[Sharpie]

1 hour ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

And he shat himself again here.

 

 

 

Would those be men who were exposing their own life and safety to protect the person they were trained, detailed and mandated to protect, some men it seems have no problem doing their duty.

[ri Alban]

7 hours ago, bobsharp said:

 

Would those be men who were exposing their own life and safety to protect the person they were trained, detailed and mandated to protect, some men it seems have no problem doing their duty.

OK bob, we heard you the first time. Personally I think these folk above are balloons. Trained to die, heard it. They're actually hiding behind Trump.

Edited February 27, 2018 by ri Alban

[Escobar PHM]

10 hours ago, Maple Leaf said:

 

 

The Secret Service got a major black eye with the JFK assassination.......

Yes. They almost got caught ! 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

10 hours ago, bobsharp said:

 

Would those be men who were exposing their own life and safety to protect the person they were trained, detailed and mandated to protect, some men it seems have no problem doing their duty.

 

That is what they are trained and paid to do.

 

I'm assuming you are having a wee dig at the guy Peterson again, well he now claims that he followed the correct procedure as the initial reports were of firecrackers and when it was realised that there was a shooter he thought that the shooter was outside the building, and what he did then was what he'd been trained to do, so he claims, now I don't know if the guy followed the correct procedure or not, I also don't know if he's lying or not either, but what I do find disturbing is that from a very early stage this guy was being thrown to the wolves, pretty much before any investigation had actually taken place.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-43202800

 

Bob, I'm not defending the guy, if he failed to do his job and is a coward then he's a coward and will have to live with the knowledge that his inaction and cowardice probably resulted in the deaths of students, but Bob, and I would have thought with you having been in the Police Force for many years would also know that let's find out all the facts and gather all the evidence before we start to assume a person's guilt.

Since this guy Peterson was branded a coward it has now emerged that there were 4 other Deputies who also failed to enter the school, why, why was that?  Perhaps and it's pure speculation on my part, but perhaps they also thought the shooter was outside and followed procedure, I don't know, but only by investigating it will the facts emerge.

 

If someone is to be branded a coward and flung to the wolves, let's just make sure it's the right person and that that person deserves to be flung to the wolves, that's all I'm saying. 

 

[The Internet]

Yeah regardless of what this Peterson guy did or didn't do the way he's been thrown under the bus by everyone right away, including the president of the United States, is absurd. 

Edited February 27, 2018 by Mauricio Pinilla

[I P Knightley]

14 hours ago, bobsharp said:

. Meanwhile the real cause of the problem is sitting in jail, being cared for, and his punishment will be to do so for the rest of his life.

 

All the stuff about Peterson and the Deputies detracts from the real issue here and give Trump and his NRA buddies more justification to continue their ignorant arguments to arm the whole of America to the back teeth. 

 

The kid may be the perpetator but he's not the cause of the problem.