Brexit Deal agreed ( updated )

[Francis Albert]

... unless you actually meant facist state, in which case I just fail to understand

[The Real Maroonblood]

On 02/01/2019 at 14:08, Ulysses said:

 

Ah here, why are you laughing?

 

You'd swear there was something wrong with a country having a Brexit Minister who didn't realise that Britain isn't physically connected to the Continent and a Transport Minister who doesn't realise that boats are useful if you want to ship stuff on water. 

 

Show a bit of respect, eh? 

You’re right.

More respect?

[ri Alban]

1 hour ago, Francis Albert said:

Were you allowed to vote? If you really believe your last sentence,  I have to doubt your mental competence.

Voting means nothing, especially for Scots.

[Jambo100]

Remember Miller had to go to court so the MP’s got to vote on Brexit..May wanted to use Henry the eighth powers to bypass parliament. We sure are a democracy.When is the election for king or Queen

[Shanks said no]

1 hour ago, Francis Albert said:

Were you allowed to vote? If you really believe your last sentence,  I have to doubt your mental competence.

FA, don't, we should embrace new posters and opinions

[Norm]

I see the Seaborne company appear to have copied and pasted the T's&C's from a takeaway company and slapped them on the website. Not the greatest 1st impression for a company to make. 

[Jambo100]

Is that the company from Ramsgate with no ships..They pay money for no deal Brexit.It is against the law for a no deal Brexit as you would have to have a border with Ireland..W T O rules.

[ri Alban]

5 minutes ago, Jambo100 said:

Remember Miller had to go to court so the MP’s got to vote on Brexit..May wanted to use Henry the eighth powers to bypass parliament. We sure are a democracy.When is the election for king or Queen

Frankie Boy is a no voting Tory Brexiteer, who loves Trump. You're better talking to your kettle.

[Jambo100]

Trump will make sure bank rates are back at 15%.Brexit will have basic tax back at 35%.You cannot upset the world markets.Stocks and share prices fall as investors invest in banks 10% return.House prices crash 65% min.People are selling multi homes now so they can buy cheap homes.Sell high buy low.

[Jambo100]

They said it is a shelf company.Like sevco.

[Victorian]

Channel 4 News seem to be quite clear about the Seaborne CEO having previous failed business and bad debt.

 

The CEO denies it.    Chris Grayling says all the proper DD was done, etc.    

 

Hmmm.    Who to believe.     It's a toughy.

[Ulysses]

3 hours ago, Normthebarman said:

I see the Seaborne company appear to have copied and pasted the T's&C's from a takeaway company and slapped them on the website. Not the greatest 1st impression for a company to make. 

 

"Condiments are for customer use only."  

 

(The above may not actually be true.)

[The Mighty Thor]

9 minutes ago, Ulysses said:

 

"Condiments are for customer use only."  

 

(The above may not actually be true.)

Ah but they'll sub contract out their condiments likesy. 

 

The Brexiteers can't see what's unravelling before their very eyes. 

 

 

[Norm]

1 hour ago, Ulysses said:

 

"Condiments are for customer use only."  

 

(The above may not actually be true.)

British Ketchup for British People. Although Heinz sounds a bit German so maybe British Brown Sauce for British people. Actually, brown things aren't too popular either.

 

Er.... Coleman's Mustard for British People?

[Unknown user]

26 minutes ago, Normthebarman said:

British Ketchup for British People. Although Heinz sounds a bit German so maybe British Brown Sauce for British people. Actually, brown things aren't too popular either.

 

Er.... Coleman's Mustard for British People?

HP is made in Holland these days, Daddies broon in Poland.

See if brexit affects my Daddies Broon...

 

[ri Alban]

8 hours ago, The Mighty Thor said:

Ah but they'll sub contract out their condiments likesy. 

 

The Brexiteers can't see what's unravelling before their very eyes. 

 

 

The Tories will sell off what's left of these 4 walls to themselves and sell it back to us for a fortune. Scotland needs to go, NOW!!!

[ri Alban]

6 hours ago, Smithee said:

HP is made in Holland these days, Daddies broon in Poland.

See if brexit affects my Daddies Broon...

 

That doesn't sound to savoury. Daddies broon.

"Hello, Police please"

Edited January 4, 2019 by ri Alban

[Thunderstruck]

On 03/01/2019 at 02:28, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

Oh it's not just this government as I am stuggling to recall a government any government over the last 30 or 40 years maybe even longer than that, which hasn't been embroiled during it's time in office, in some corruption scandal or another, and it's not just the UK either, it's like this all over the world.

 

 

The awarding of publicly funded contracts to companies owned by donors to the ruling party wouldn’t happen in Scotland, would it?

 

Of course it would and the irony of it is that was for the building of ships. 

[Thunderstruck]

15 hours ago, Jambo100 said:

I How can it be voice of the people..Students unable to vote.E U workers with kids at UK schools not allowed to vote.Students told to vote at university..Election in June.A trade union would be breaking the law if they went on strike.The far right won the election on their terms.The result. 17m leave.16m stay 13m did not vote and 3.5m not given a vote. 37.3% not including the 3.5m not allowed to vote.The UK is a facist state.

 

There is no way of knowing for certain how those who didn’t vote might have voted.

 

In this case, however, the finger should be pointed at the 13m who didn’t bother to vote. It would be interesting to know how many of those that complain loudest about the result actually cast a vote. 

 

If we must have referendums, make them on the basis of a supermajority in favour of change or make it at least 50%+1 of the electorate (the total number of electors registered and able to vote). 

[ri Alban]

42 minutes ago, Thunderstruck said:

 

There is no way of knowing for certain how those who didn’t vote might have voted.

 

In this case, however, the finger should be pointed at the 13m who didn’t bother to vote. It would be interesting to know how many of those that complain loudest about the result actually cast a vote. 

 

If we must have referendums, make them on the basis of a supermajority in favour of change or make it at least 50%+1 of the electorate (the total number of electors registered and able to vote). 

Just let England leave, but on the off chance there's another EU referendum. I hope Scotland makes England stay. That would be fecking hilarious. And you'd be fecking raging. But there won't and the Guardians of Scotland will keep us safe until they free us from tyranny.

[jambocub]

15 hours ago, ri Alban said:

Voting means nothing, especially for Scots.

Why's that?

[Thunderstruck]

41 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Just let England leave, but on the off chance there's another EU referendum. I hope Scotland makes England stay. That would be fecking hilarious. And you'd be fecking raging. But there won't and the Guardians of Scotland will keep us safe until they free us from tyranny.

 

‘Guardians of Scotland’ - are you off your meds again. 

[ri Alban]

Ross 'SNP gain' Thomson is on the verge of deselection over brexit. SNP gain , that's a belter.

[ri Alban]

45 minutes ago, Thunderstruck said:

 

‘Guardians of Scotland’ - are you off your meds again. 

Are you out yer tits again.

[The Real Maroonblood]

32 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Are you out yer tits again.

[JudyJudyJudy]

12 hours ago, Thunderstruck said:

 

There is no way of knowing for certain how those who didn’t vote might have voted.

 

In this case, however, the finger should be pointed at the 13m who didn’t bother to vote. It would be interesting to know how many of those that complain loudest about the result actually cast a vote. 

 

If we must have referendums, make them on the basis of a supermajority in favour of change or make it at least 50%+1 of the electorate (the total number of electors registered and able to vote). 

I recall a rather naive student on Question time complaining  about the ref result , then astonishingly admitted she hadnt even voted. 

[JudyJudyJudy]

10 hours ago, ri Alban said:

Ross 'SNP gain' Thomson is on the verge of deselection over brexit. SNP gain , that's a belter.

Hes a massive bell end..

[JudyJudyJudy]

They are certainly ranking up the " no deal scenario"...scaremongering at its best or worse

[JamboX2]

If we're all honest, the deal is simply a half way house to the actual future relationship. It's crap but it's only stage 1 of Brexit: the getting out bit. It's crap mainly because leaving is bad.

 

What should probably happen - if we had politicians worth their salt - is the deal is approved or a referendum occurs to say remain or the deal. If the deal is approved in either option the government resigns and we either have (a) a national unity government to negotiate the future deal or (b) a second election.

 

Otherwise I fear we will no deal by default and that will be utterly woeful. 

 

Sadly, the options are increasingly this interim deal with the hope of a SM/CU deal or an absolute catastrophe.

[JudyJudyJudy]

46 minutes ago, JamboX2 said:

If we're all honest, the deal is simply a half way house to the actual future relationship. It's crap but it's only stage 1 of Brexit: the getting out bit. It's crap mainly because leaving is bad.

 

What should probably happen - if we had politicians worth their salt - is the deal is approved or a referendum occurs to say remain or the deal. If the deal is approved in either option the government resigns and we either have (a) a national unity government to negotiate the future deal or (b) a second election.

 

Otherwise I fear we will no deal by default and that will be utterly woeful. 

 

Sadly, the options are increasingly this interim deal with the hope of a SM/CU deal or an absolute catastrophe.

Yeah i can see it going this way too.

[Francis Albert]

Wrong thread

Edited January 5, 2019 by Francis Albert

[Jambo-Jimbo]

16 hours ago, JamesM48 said:

I recall a rather naive student on Question time complaining  about the ref result , then astonishingly admitted she hadnt even voted. 

 

Sky News was interviewing a guy several weeks ago (think he was another student) and it was the same as above, moaning and groaning about the result, but he then revealed during the interview that he hadn't bothered to vote in the EU ref himself, when asked why not, his reply was that he'd thought remain would win so didn't see the need for him to vote.

 

I think there is one thing which we can all agree on and that is, if you are entitled to vote but choose not to or just couldn't be bothered, then you have no right whatsoever to moan and groan about the result of the said vote.

[Norm]

24 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

Sky News was interviewing a guy several weeks ago (think he was another student) and it was the same as above, moaning and groaning about the result, but he then revealed during the interview that he hadn't bothered to vote in the EU ref himself, when asked why not, his reply was that he'd thought remain would win so didn't see the need for him to vote.

 

I think there is one thing which we can all agree on and that is, if you are entitled to vote but choose not to or just couldn't be bothered, then you have no right whatsoever to moan and groan about the result of the said vote.

In a referendum, you're right. In a General Election, I'm with the great George Carlin. You can't blame non voters because a bunch of arseholes voted in another arsehole. The people to blame in that instance, are the arseholes who voted for another arsehole. 

[Mikey1874]

1 hour ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

Sky News was interviewing a guy several weeks ago (think he was another student) and it was the same as above, moaning and groaning about the result, but he then revealed during the interview that he hadn't bothered to vote in the EU ref himself, when asked why not, his reply was that he'd thought remain would win so didn't see the need for him to vote.

 

I think there is one thing which we can all agree on and that is, if you are entitled to vote but choose not to or just couldn't be bothered, then you have no right whatsoever to moan and groan about the result of the said vote.

 

This is a factor in the different polls.

 

Polls are not votes. Young people voted less in 2016. Are they included more than they should in polls? I've seen some analysis saying there is no significant change in total. Channel 4 did a big poll which was 54% Remain but accounting for young not voting was no change on the Referendum result. 

[coconut doug]

On ‎04‎/‎01‎/‎2019 at 06:13, Thunderstruck said:

 

The awarding of publicly funded contracts to companies owned by donors to the ruling party wouldn’t happen in Scotland, would it?

 

Of course it would and the irony of it is that was for the building of ships. 

Is this not you indulging in Whataboutery, something you frequently complain about?

 

Were you not the poster who complained about Calmac ferries being built in Poland and blamed this on the SNP?

 

Are you suggesting that the ships were only built in Fergusons because the owner was a donor to the SNP?

 

Do you know of another yard in Scotland where these ships could have been built?

 

Were the vessels built at Fergusons actually needed and do they actually exist?

 

When these ships were built did it save the company and keep people in jobs?

 

Can you explain what need the Seaborne freight contract addresses and how this company is likely to contribute? 

 

Do you think it acceptable for a company to pass a government due diligence test when at least one of the directors left a company owing several hundred thousand pounds and the other directors have no experience in this field? Is it acceptable for those carrying out the DD to ignore the companies terms and conditions?

 

Is it acceptable for directors of this company who have no earnings yet and may not ever make any money to immediately pay themselves subsantial monies even though they know they are extremely unlikely to do any trading?

 

Are you honestly suggesting that what happened with Fergusons is in any meaningful way comparable with Seaborne Freight.

 

 

[coconut doug]

13 hours ago, JamboX2 said:

If we're all honest, the deal is simply a half way house to the actual future relationship. It's crap but it's only stage 1 of Brexit: the getting out bit. It's crap mainly because leaving is bad.

 

What should probably happen - if we had politicians worth their salt - is the deal is approved or a referendum occurs to say remain or the deal. If the deal is approved in either option the government resigns and we either have (a) a national unity government to negotiate the future deal or (b) a second election.

 

Otherwise I fear we will no deal by default and that will be utterly woeful. 

 

Sadly, the options are increasingly this interim deal with the hope of a SM/CU deal or an absolute catastrophe.

Surely if the Deal is accepted by parliament or in a referendum the government is vindicatedand would not resign. 

 

Isn't your frequent reference to natioal unity government ridiculous in this political climate? Is it not just a personal desire to get closer to the Tories?

 

 

[Ulysses]

5 hours ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

I think there is one thing which we can all agree on and that is, if you are entitled to vote but choose not to or just couldn't be bothered, then you have no right whatsoever to moan and groan about the result of the said vote.

 

Sorry to be pedantic, but......

 

.....I'd be more inclined to agree with you if you said something along the lines of "if you are entitled to vote but choose not to or just couldn't be bothered, then don't be surprised if others don't take you seriously if you moan and groan about the result of the said vote."

 

The right to vote includes the right not to vote, and the right to free expression isn't lost by not voting.  But, if someone doesn't vote, they are in a pretty weak position if they blame others for the outcome or if they expect others to take them seriously when they complain about the result.

[Cade]

Tragic far-right loons in hi-viz jackets showing up in a couple of English cities again this weekend, a pish poor parody of the French Gillet Jaunes (which themselves are pish poor). 

 

Several arrests have been made including a 13 year old girl on a charge of assaulting a police officer.

 

Lots of EDL representation at the gatherings (can't really call them marches as you need more than a few dozen people to be able to call it a march).

 

Lots of chants about Brexit, all MP's being traitors deserving hanging, lots of anti-muslim sentiment on show too, EU flags being burned, the whole shebang of shan behaviour.

 

Absolute sad cases.

Edited January 5, 2019 by Cade

[Ulysses]

1 minute ago, Cade said:

Tragic far-right loons in hi-viz jackets showing up in a couple of English cities again this weekend, a pish poor parody of the French Gillet Jaunes (which themselves are pish poor). 

 

Several arrests have been made including a 13 year old girl on a charge of assaulting a police officer.

 

Lots of EDL representation at the gatherings (can't really call them marches as you need more than a few dozen people to be able to call it a march).

 

Absolute sad cases.

 

 

We had an incident here over Christmas where a small group of zoomers in hi-viz blocked a road tunnel for a wee while.  Among their banners was one promoting a chemtrails conspiracy theory website, and they promoted the protest using a Facebook page in the name of the "Irish Citizens Army". 

 

Headbangers. 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

53 minutes ago, Ulysses said:

 

Sorry to be pedantic, but......

 

.....I'd be more inclined to agree with you if you said something along the lines of "if you are entitled to vote but choose not to or just couldn't be bothered, then don't be surprised if others don't take you seriously if you moan and groan about the result of the said vote."

 

The right to vote includes the right not to vote, and the right to free expression isn't lost by not voting.  But, if someone doesn't vote, they are in a pretty weak position if they blame others for the outcome or if they expect others to take them seriously when they complain about the result.

 

Uly, you have a much better way in expressing what I wrote, so can I change what I wrote to what you wrote.  ?

[Ulysses]

12 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

Uly, you have a much better way in expressing what I wrote, so can I change what I wrote to what you wrote.  ?

 

No problem, but let's face it you wrote what we're all tempted to say. 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

5 hours ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

This is a factor in the different polls.

 

Polls are not votes. Young people voted less in 2016. Are they included more than they should in polls? I've seen some analysis saying there is no significant change in total. Channel 4 did a big poll which was 54% Remain but accounting for young not voting was no change on the Referendum result. 

 

I don't trust polls all that much tbh.

 

You could ask 1000 people the same question on two different days and you'd probably get two different results.

 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

Just now, Ulysses said:

 

No problem, but let's face it you wrote what we're all tempted to say. 

 

[The Mighty Thor]

1 hour ago, Cade said:

Tragic far-right loons in hi-viz jackets showing up in a couple of English cities again this weekend, a pish poor parody of the French Gillet Jaunes (which themselves are pish poor). 

 

Several arrests have been made including a 13 year old girl on a charge of assaulting a police officer.

 

Lots of EDL representation at the gatherings (can't really call them marches as you need more than a few dozen people to be able to call it a march).

 

Lots of chants about Brexit, all MP's being traitors deserving hanging, lots of anti-muslim sentiment on show too, EU flags being burned, the whole shebang of shan behaviour.

 

Absolute sad cases.

Much fun and games to come. Firstly when parliament reconvenes and Madame has to sell her bag of shite to anyone who will listen. It's not going to be a dull few months coming up. 

[Thunderstruck]

15 hours ago, coconut doug said:

Is this not you indulging in Whataboutery, something you frequently complain about?

 

No, simply highlighting hypocrisy. 

 

Quote

Were you not the poster who complained about Calmac ferries being built in Poland and blamed this on the SNP?

 

Correct on both counts. The ships could have been built in the U.K. or Scotland - if there was a will so to do. 

 

Quote

Are you suggesting that the ships were only built in Fergusons because the owner was a donor to the SNP?

 

The yard was rescued a matter of days before the Referendum. It had been struggling for years but I am sure the timing of (and the razzmatazz surrounding) the announcement was purely coincidental. 

 

Quote

Do you know of another yard in Scotland where these ships could have been built?

 

See above, this yard was in existence, in need of orders and could easily have coped. 

 

Quote

Were the vessels built at Fergusons actually needed and do they actually exist?

 

Yes and Yes. Drive or take a train to Port Glasgow and you will see both of the new Arran ferries that they are building.

 

You really haven’t been paying attention if you think that the number of suitable vessels available to Cal-Mac is in any way adequate.

 

Incidentally, how many vessels do you think are owned by the ferry operator CalMac Ltd.?  To save you looking, the answer is none; they are all leased - a far from uncommon arrangement in Shipping and not a problem unless you are a company called Seabourne. 

 

Quote

When these ships were built did it save the company and keep people in jobs?

 

Yes but I will repeat - why did it take so long?  Surely not for headlines - that wouldn’t be fair on the existing and former workforce, would it?

 

When it was saved, what promises of orders were made to the new owners? Do you think any sensible businessman would have piled in his cash without some guarantees?

 

Quote

Can you explain what need the Seaborne freight contract addresses and how this company is likely to contribute? 

 

Do you think it acceptable for a company to pass a government due diligence test when at least one of the directors left a company owing several hundred thousand pounds and the other directors have no experience in this field? Is it acceptable for those carrying out the DD to ignore the companies terms and conditions?

 

Is it acceptable for directors of this company who have no earnings yet and may not ever make any money to immediately pay themselves subsantial monies even though they know they are extremely unlikely to do any trading?

 

I don’t see the Seabourne contract as useful or required in the overall effort - if the need arises. 

 

To me, it looks like a misguided attempt to bring the disused (in terms of ferry traffic) port of Folkestone back into use. It stopped being useful for a reason - it was unsuited to modern vessels. 

 

The hysteria surrounding the contract has, however, thrown up some crazy notions:-

 

1. The company was initially accused of having no specialist shipping experience but, latterly, we learned that the directors are also directors of a separate shipping company. 

 

2. A new company is slated for having borrowings and no earnings. Has that never happened in any business, ever?

 

But, back to the contract. In my view, there was no need for it. ABP has invested heavily in its Humber ports with Network Rail also investing to improve the track gauge to Immingham. Not such a quick crossing but likely to be a better fit for traffic from the north of the U.K. and Ireland. Subsidising these routes would have been a better use of the money. 

 

Speaking of Ireland, I’m sure that, when he was conspiring with Juncker and Tusk to weaponise the Irish border, Veradkar did not foresee the impact on Irish trade that might arise from the congestion that would be caused on the ‘Road Bridge’ to the EU if no deal could be achieved. The law of unintended consequences can be a real bitch. 

 

Quote

Are you honestly suggesting that what happened with Fergusons is in any meaningful way comparable with Seaborne Freight.

 

They both look more than a little suspicious. 

[ri Alban]

12 hours ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

Uly, you have a much better way in expressing what I wrote, so can I change what I wrote to what you wrote.  ?

[Victorian]

May about to appear on Andrew Marr amid some newspaper speculation that she will delay the vote again.

 

 

[The Mighty Thor]

2 hours ago, Victorian said:

May about to appear on Andrew Marr amid some newspaper speculation that she will delay the vote again.

 

 

Marr could and should have nailed her to the wall. 

The EU have 'made some changes'? No they haven't you slavering bint.

 

Yet another easy ride from the BBC. Their journalistic quality and integrity is at an all time low even from their piss poor benchmark.

 

[Victorian]

35 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

Marr could and should have nailed her to the wall. 

The EU have 'made some changes'? No they haven't you slavering bint.

 

Yet another easy ride from the BBC. Their journalistic quality and integrity is at an all time low even from their piss poor benchmark.

 

 

A regular feature for Marr.     He's a horrendous interviewer,    even at his best.      May didn't even have to get out of 1st gear to swat him off.     Said,  confirmed,  pledged,  guaranteed,  promised nothing regarding the immediate parliamenary process and beyond.     A waste of air time.

[The Real Maroonblood]

2 hours ago, The Mighty Thor said:

Marr could and should have nailed her to the wall. 

The EU have 'made some changes'? No they haven't you slavering bint.

 

Yet another easy ride from the BBC. Their journalistic quality and integrity is at an all time low even from their piss poor benchmark.

 

No one decent since Robin Day.