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Brexit Deal agreed ( updated )


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A side matter reported earlier and partly seen on TV. 

 

Gina Miller and Shami Chakrabarti were aggressively shouted at by pro-Brexit supporters. Joanna Cherry who has been on TV a lot more than the others was ignored. 

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The Mighty Thor

Some of the reports of Boris' meeting with Juncker in Luxembourg are pretty special. 

 

Reports of 'the penny dropping' and a total lack of understanding of the workings of the single market or the back stop workings. 

 

Wonder how he's getting on with the 30 day deadline on alternative proposals he was trumpeting on about with Merkel?

 

It's not really going that well is it?

 

 

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16 minutes ago, Victorian said:

First time I've seen that hospital footage.    What a ****ing cretin.    "There's no press here... ".     Either utterly oblivious to what's right there in front of him or so conditioned to deception that he just blurted out another lie in the expectation it would be believed.

 

The guy wasn't the most coherent so he didn't really embarrass the ***** as he should have been.    Then some arrogant ****er says "You're going to have to lower your voice now... ".

 

**** off.    Ask the guy to kindly lower his voice.    The guy's visiting his child in hospital ffs.

And there is a social media campaign, led by Laura  Kunsberg (sp?) to discredit him because he is a Labour activist.

 

This cuts both ways.  Yes to  an extent  but a Tory, or Brexit Party activist fawning instead in the same personal situation is equally as bad, if not worse.

Edited by DETTY29
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2 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

Some of the reports of Boris' meeting with Juncker in Luxembourg are pretty special. 

 

Reports of 'the penny dropping' and a total lack of understanding of the workings of the single market or the back stop workings. 

 

Wonder how he's getting on with the 30 day deadline on alternative proposals he was trumpeting on about with Merkel?

 

It's not really going that well is it?

 

 

 

Saw a report to that effect.    He's really just a bag of shit who's been trying to blag it like a sharp practice salesman.   

 

Before he started I said he would think he could pretty much delegate everything to others.    Some reports have suggested he's trying to do just that.     Even to the extent of knowing what the **** is going on.

 

Just an odious bag of shite.

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4 minutes ago, DETTY29 said:

And there is a social media campaign, led by Laura  Kunsberg (sp?) to discredit him because he is a Labour activist.

 

This cuts both ways.  Yes to  an extent  but a Tory, or Brexit Party activist fawning instead in the same personal situation is equally as bad, if not worse.

 

Don't think Kuenssberg is at it tbh.    Just being a bit dense.   Poor judgement.

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The Mighty Thor
9 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

Don't think Kuenssberg is at it tbh.    Just being a bit dense.   Poor judgement.

I disagree. 

She's up to her baws in it. She works for a public broadcaster. Given the Ben Stokes & Gareth Thomas stuff she's ****ing naive at best and malicious at worst. She should have her arse booted for this. 

 

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Being reported that Scotland has indeed lost a $1B+ bid for the upcoming Amazon Lord of the Rings series to New Zealand as a result of "Brexit uncertainty".

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2 hours ago, Victorian said:

 

Saw a report to that effect.    He's really just a bag of shit who's been trying to blag it like a sharp practice salesman.   

 

Before he started I said he would think he could pretty much delegate everything to others.    Some reports have suggested he's trying to do just that.     Even to the extent of knowing what the **** is going on.

 

Just an odious bag of shite.

 

A negative decision by the Supreme Court would surely sink him with any luck.

I can see him asking for an extension and him being grant one then Parliament will pull the rug from under him.

 

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9 hours ago, Dannie Boy said:

 

A negative decision by the Supreme Court would surely sink him with any luck.

I can see him asking for an extension and him being grant one then Parliament will pull the rug from under him.

 

 

I don't think it will affect Johnson or Cummmings.

 

The prorogation has already had its affect. It failed to stop MPs passing the law 'preventing' No Deal. And it prevented debate on Yellowhammer or the production of advice on the prorogation or a vote to make MPs sit during the party conferences.

 

Any decision I think will be cautious. If against the Government I think it will give them a way out. 

 

 

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EU starting to turn the screw by suggesting their own deadline for meaningful proposals to appear.     Quite right too.     If I was a citizen of another EU state then I would probably be calling for the EU to declare no deal right now.

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28 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

I don't think it will affect Johnson or Cummmings.

 

The prorogation has already had its affect. It failed to stop MPs passing the law 'preventing' No Deal. And it prevented debate on Yellowhammer or the production of advice on the prorogation or a vote to make MPs sit during the party conferences.

 

Any decision I think will be cautious. If against the Government I think it will give them a way out. 

 

 

 

This is how I see it panning out as well.

 

The Judiciary will be extremely reluctant to interfere too much in the Legislative.

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1 hour ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

 

The prorogation has already had its affect. It failed to stop MPs passing the law 'preventing' No Deal.

 

No it didn't.

That got rushed through both Houses and got Royal Assent.

Boris is now legally obliged to ask for an extension after the EU summit ending on 17th October if no deal has yet been ratified.

 

 

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6 minutes ago, Cade said:

No it didn't.

That got rushed through both Houses and got Royal Assent.

Boris is now legally obliged to ask for an extension after the EU summit ending on 17th October if no deal has yet been ratified.

 

 

 

That's what I said "failed to stop". The prorogation was aimed to prevent that. The point being the point of it has passed. 

 

So Government won't be too bothered if it has to recall Parliament now. 

 

Its aiming for an election against 'the enemies of the people". 

Edited by Mikey1874
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All roads lead to Gorgie
1 hour ago, Mikey1874 said:

David Cameron really is an idiot. 

It is a collective thing in his party to be fair! 

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The Government submission on what it would do if case goes against them. People are saying it says Government may prorogue Parliament again. 

 

 

Edited by Mikey1874
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3 hours ago, Mikey1874 said:

David Cameron really is an idiot. 

Is he?

 

Might just push the next pro indy campign to have to really consider deciding not having the monarchy and split the Yes vote.

 

However QE dies and Charles is King with Camilla Queen at next Indy Referendum then it's probably an easier to leave the monarchy behind.

 

Wills and Kate, maybe not so.

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Brexit Sec telling the EU to "take a risk on the Irish border"

 

That's all we have.

 

"Give it a go, see what happens, who cares about peace treaties anyhow?"

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43 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

The Government submission on what it would do if case goes against them. People are saying it says Government may prorogue Parliament again. 

 

 

If the government tries that, then surely that would drive a significant divide between government and monarchy?

 

Maybe not so smart after all Boris.

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1 hour ago, DETTY29 said:

Is he?

 

Might just push the next pro indy campign to have to really consider deciding not having the monarchy and split the Yes vote.

 

However QE dies and Charles is King with Camilla Queen at next Indy Referendum then it's probably an easier to leave the monarchy behind.

 

Wills and Kate, maybe not so.

 

The Queen has quickly expressed herself today as 'pretty pissed off' with Cameron.

 

She knows the score. 

 

 

Edited by Mikey1874
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It will be ruled in favour of Bojo, nap.  The privileged in which he really serves is also protected by the high court judges  ..  

 

 

 

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49 minutes ago, maroonlegions said:

It will be ruled in favour of Bojo, nap.  The privileged in which he really serves is also protected by the high court judges  ..  

 

 

 

You know, I hope you are wrong but I fear that this may be the case. He’s part of that ‘old school tie’ club. 

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9 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

A point that's been made before about trade deals.

 

Britain is working on a deal with Australia that could include freedom of movement. 

We building a tunnel?

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6 hours ago, Pans Jambo said:

We building a tunnel?

 

I don't know if you ever saw the "remake" of Total Recall (the original classic Arnold Schwarzenegger movie). One of the elements of it was the exact same premise, a tunnel through the centre of the Earth from the UK to Australia, by which workers were transported. The remake had some nice bits to it but wasn't a patch on the original. Anyway, I wouldn't put it past Boris to suggest it. ;)

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UK Brexit team asking the EU negotiation team not to give any information to any of the 27 EU member states.

:interehjrling:

 

Wonder why??

And I also wonder how the UK team think this is going to ever be accepted.

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53 minutes ago, Cade said:

UK Brexit team asking the EU negotiation team not to give any information to any of the 27 EU member states.

:interehjrling:

 

Wonder why??

And I also wonder how the UK team think this is going to ever be accepted.

 

Stands to reason.   A government that shuts down it's own parliament to avoid scrutiny would think it normal for the EU to be equally devious.     It will be wanting the retention of details in order prevent leaking of information back to the UK.     Another indication that the government's stated strategy to achieve a deal is not it's actual strategy.

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The Mighty Thor
6 hours ago, Cade said:

UK Brexit team asking the EU negotiation team not to give any information to any of the 27 EU member states.

:interehjrling:

 

Wonder why??

And I also wonder how the UK team think this is going to ever be accepted.

So they didn't 😂

And of course the submissions from the UK amount to bugger all.

30 days later and still nothing of any consequence.

Tick tock.

IMG_20190920_174717.jpg

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UK wants to leave the EU and the Customs Union.

This causes a hard border in Northern Ireland, which breaches the Good Friday Agreement.

EU comes up with the Backstop which keeps NI in the Customs Union if no other solutions can be found.

UK has come up with shite-all in three and a half years other than crying about the Backstop.

 

Tragic.

 

 

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In the meantime, there's going to be a vote held shortly to oust Tom Watson as deputy Labour leader and insiders reckon it will succeed.

 

What the feck are the Labour party thinking about? They're on a path to self-destruction, effectively handing the country over to the Tories.

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49776100

Edited by redjambo
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5 hours ago, redjambo said:

In the meantime, there's going to be a vote held shortly to oust Tom Watson as deputy Labour leader and insiders reckon it will succeed.

 

What the feck are the Labour party thinking about? They're on a path to self-destruction, effectively handing the country over to the Tories.

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49776100

 

Tbh Lib Dem’s could benefit most from that. They seem determined to virtually become ‘New Labour’ as it is of late. Labour on the other hand seem determined to become a fringe party with no chance of ever winning an election.

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Labour is strange.

 

Tom Watson as Deputy Leader is like Teresa May having Jacob Rees Mogg as Deputy Leader. 

 

Their risk is an internal split that has been coming spews out into the open. Before an election. Corbyn supporters going all in. 

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1 hour ago, Ibrahim Tall said:

 

Tbh Lib Dem’s could benefit most from that. They seem determined to virtually become ‘New Labour’ as it is of late. Labour on the other hand seem determined to become a fringe party with no chance of ever winning an election.

 

LDs are absolutely not any version of New Labour.    They've taken in a couple of disaffected,  cardboard cut-out Labour MPs but they've also been happy to take in a few Tory MPs who have previous voting records that diverge widely from their own stated LD 'values'.     Their leader is an overt greasy pole climber with no genuine political philosophy.    The female Nick Clegg.

 

LD Brexit policy has made them a party on the extremes of opinion.    They have set themselves full square against anyone who voted leave or subsequently chooses to 'honour' the referendum result.    Their 1st choice policy is to cancel the result of the referendum snd not hold another one. 

 

Labour's policy is to negotiate with the EU to attempt to achieve a deal and then allow the public to vote between that and remain.    Giving people another democratic choice.

 

Labour - pro democratic choice.   Clear social and economic policies.

 

LD - clear strategy to maximise number of seats via extreme, notional,  undeliverable promise.   Only want a Westminster bloc to achieve balance of power.   Likely to u-turn and prop up another Tory minority government on a vote-by-vote basis.    A barrier to real reform.

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7 hours ago, redjambo said:

In the meantime, there's going to be a vote held shortly to oust Tom Watson as deputy Labour leader and insiders reckon it will succeed.

 

What the feck are the Labour party thinking about? They're on a path to self-destruction, effectively handing the country over to the Tories.

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49776100

 

Welcome to UK politics in 2019.

 

We have a Tory party who may or may not have broken the law, either way though are playing fast & loose with at least the spirit of democracy.

 

The Lib Dems just want to ignore democracy altogether and overturn the largest democratic vote in UK history, because they didn't like the result.

 

And now we have a powerful movement within the Labour party who want to circumnavigate Labour's own rules and get rid any dissenting voice, who doesn't agree with Corbyn.

 

This is the state of UK politics now, 3 of the largest parties who are showing a scant regard for the rule of democracy.

 

Last week we had many thousands of people take to the streets to 'defend democracy', I look forward to similar taking place, wont be holding my breath tho.

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Brighton Jambo
1 hour ago, Victorian said:

 

LDs are absolutely not any version of New Labour.    They've taken in a couple of disaffected,  cardboard cut-out Labour MPs but they've also been happy to take in a few Tory MPs who have previous voting records that diverge widely from their own stated LD 'values'.     Their leader is an overt greasy pole climber with no genuine political philosophy.    The female Nick Clegg.

 

LD Brexit policy has made them a party on the extremes of opinion.    They have set themselves full square against anyone who voted leave or subsequently chooses to 'honour' the referendum result.    Their 1st choice policy is to cancel the result of the referendum snd not hold another one. 

 

Labour's policy is to negotiate with the EU to attempt to achieve a deal and then allow the public to vote between that and remain.    Giving people another democratic choice.

 

Labour - pro democratic choice.   Clear social and economic policies.

 

LD - clear strategy to maximise number of seats via extreme, notional,  undeliverable promise.   Only want a Westminster bloc to achieve balance of power.   Likely to u-turn and prop up another Tory minority government on a vote-by-vote basis.    A barrier to real reform.

Are you being serious? Emily Thornberry actually said that in the event of securing a deal labour might actually then campaign against that deal.  They are a total shambles on brexit and their leader, incredibly, after three years still hasn’t made his position clear.

 

On the eve of their conference the left wing of the party is trying to force out one of the more respected and moderate front benchers.  So rather than the headlines being about their social and brexit position it’s all about infighting and the role of momentum.  

 

This is is he worst Tory government in living memory, they are a right wing, toxic mess led by a baffoon.  Yet they have a double digit polls lead over labour.  Any other opposition in any other era would be streets ahead in the polls but labour trail even the Lib Dem’s.

 

They are literally unelectable.  

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2 minutes ago, Brighton Jambo said:

Are you being serious? Emily Thornberry actually said that in the event of securing a deal labour might actually then campaign against that deal.  They are a total shambles on brexit and their leader, incredibly, after three years still hasn’t made his position clear.

 

On the eve of their conference the left wing of the party is trying to force out one of the more respected and moderate front benchers.  So rather than the headlines being about their social and brexit position it’s all about infighting and the role of momentum.  

 

This is is he worst Tory government in living memory, they are a right wing, toxic mess led by a baffoon.  Yet they have a double digit polls lead over labour.  Any other opposition in any other era would be streets ahead in the polls but labour trail even the Lib Dem’s.

 

They are literally unelectable.  

 

It's only unclear if you don't make half an effort to understand it.    

 

Negotiate a deal with the EU.   Place the choice of that deal against our current deal (EU membership) in a referendum for the public to decide upon.     It's entirely legitimate to campaign to remain.    They will campaign based on the nature of the negotiated deal.

 

Could not be clearer.    Gives people another democratic choice.   

 

But it's easier to just parrot out all the old Labour tropes.     

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Brighton Jambo
5 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

It's only unclear if you don't make half an effort to understand it.    

 

Negotiate a deal with the EU.   Place the choice of that deal against our current deal (EU membership) in a referendum for the public to decide upon.     It's entirely legitimate to campaign to remain.    They will campaign based on the nature of the negotiated deal.

 

Could not be clearer.    Gives people another democratic choice.   

 

But it's easier to just parrot out all the old Labour tropes.     

So if they are going to campaign for remain what incentive will they have to get the best deal possible. It’s a laughable shambolic position. 

 

As as I said unelectable.  

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12 minutes ago, Brighton Jambo said:

So if they are going to campaign for remain what incentive will they have to get the best deal possible. It’s a laughable shambolic position. 

 

As as I said unelectable.  

 

Corbyn has stated on numerous occasions that he'd negotiate a deal which keeps the UK in the single market & a customs union.

 

So the 'choice' Labour would put to the electorate is this.

 

A - Vote for my deal which keeps the UK in the single market & a customs union.

B - Vote to stay with the current deal.

 

In other words stay in the EU either way.

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All of the traditional "big three" parties are in a total mess.

Tories and Labour split by factional infighting.

LibDems are letting casualties of the other two join them and are seriously angering their grass roots by doing so and also for considering de-selecting life-long LD MPs so the new guys can be parachuted into safe or marginal seats.

 

A General Election any time in the next year or so is almost impossible to predict.

Absolutely anything could happen.

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  • davemclaren changed the title to Brexit Deal agreed ( updated )

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