Brexit Deal agreed ( updated )

[NANOJAMBO]

1 minute ago, Ulysses said:

 

Tony's excellent. 

 

In any negotiation, the trick is to increase your leverage and take measures that damage the other guy more than you.  In broad terms, the EU has more scope to do that generally, whereas the UK has more scope in specific areas.  In broad brush terms, I'd say that the EU's best tactical approach would be to target particular sectors, goods and services, whereas the best tactical approach by the British would be to target countries - not directly, but by targeting particular sectors which would in turn affect particular countries.  One way or the other, Ireland is likely to be a central feature.

Any fear in Ireland that they might be the sacrificial lambs in all this ? Albeit, they have the weight of the EU behind them ?  Assuming we have a trade war ( bring it on, Johnson will be gone in short order) , the EU has shown how it's able to target poltically sensitive areas to maximise its leverage, but I don't see the UK having the same power given the UK economy is service driven. Thoughts ? 

[Ulysses]

12 hours ago, NANOJAMBO said:

Any fear in Ireland that they might be the sacrificial lambs in all this ? Albeit, they have the weight of the EU behind them ?  Assuming we have a trade war ( bring it on, Johnson will be gone in short order) , the EU has shown how it's able to target poltically sensitive areas to maximise its leverage, but I don't see the UK having the same power given the UK economy is service driven. Thoughts ? 

 

It's obvious that people on the hard right in the UK see Ireland as a weak spot, and that annoys some people here - but they'd probably get annoyed with the hard right and the British anyway. 

 

In relative terms, Ireland is more exposed to the UK economy than other EU member countries - but the extent of that exposure is a lot less than it used to be.  About 9% of our exports go to the UK, and about 22% of our imports come from there.  The loss of imports would be a problem for supply chains, hence the tripling of our direct connections to the continent.  We're already seeing a restructuring of our UK trade, with more trade happening with NI and less with GB, so a trade/tariff war would disrupt that.  It would be difficult, but not unmanageable.

 

Right now, the difficulty for the British government is that it has badly misread the EU, Ireland and NI.  It has assumed that the EU will sort it out with last-minute deals and concessions - forgetting that this is something we do to benefit our members, and the UK isn't a member any more.  It has assumed that Ireland is still more connected to the British economy than the Single Market - forgetting that somewhere between 25% and 35% of employment in Ireland now depends on the Single Market.  And it has assumed that NI remains a place where the writ of the leaders of unionism still runs - forgetting that this simply isn't the case, and that in any event that the business community is already finding ways to live with and profit from the Protocol.

 

I think the first assumption is nearly dead, and the British government probably now knows that the EU doesn't see the UK as a reliable partner or neighbour.  The assumptions about Ireland are no surprise, because they reflect what a lot of British people (especially English people) know about the place.  At best, that belief is stuck in a time warp in the late 80s or early 90s; at worst it belongs to an even earlier time.

 

As to the UK economy being service-driven, I'll stick to saying that a lot of the tactical options available to the EU are in fact outside the Protocol and outside the TCA.  It'd be better for all concerned if they didn't have to be used.

[The Mighty Thor]

3 hours ago, Ulysses said:

 

In relative terms, Ireland is more exposed to the UK economy than other EU member countries - but the extent of that exposure is a lot less than it used to be.  About 9% of our exports go to the UK, and about 22% of our imports 

As to the UK economy being service-driven, I'll stick to saying that a lot of the tactical options available to the EU are in fact outside the Protocol and outside the TCA.  It'd be better for all concerned if they didn't have to be used.

I've often thought that best way to hurt countries like the UK & US is to do nothing. 

Generally the governments of the day **** things up for themselves better than any petty trade embargoes could ever manage. 

That's certainly the case for our current clown show.  

[NANOJAMBO]

 

That time "Joe" told Johnson the US put a lot of work into the GFA and expect it to honoured.... 

 

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40718376.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

 

State Senate Presidents/Majority leaders from across the US met in Dublin to plan their response to the crisis The event preceeds the largest gathering of Irish American legislators in 100 years in the US next month to coordinate bipartizan action at state/federal levels

 

 

As Brexit tensions continue this week between the EU and UK, the launch of the American Irish State Legislators Caucus took place on Monday in Dublin's Mansion House.

State Senate Presidents and Majority leaders from across the US attended the event, with Carol Murphy, the majority leader of the New Jersey Assembly, saying it was a "great way to continue to strengthen the links between Ireland and the US and to continue to support Ireland, the Good Friday Agreement and the Peace Process."

 

The core aim of the caucus is to promote economic and political links between America and Ireland, with support for the Good Friday Agreement at the heart of the group's principles, according to a statement.

 

 

[Ulysses]

4 hours ago, The Mighty Thor said:

I've often thought that best way to hurt countries like the UK & US is to do nothing. 

Generally the governments of the day **** things up for themselves better than any petty trade embargoes could ever manage. 

That's certainly the case for our current clown show.  

 

The United States isn't the problem here, so I won't comment on that.

 

The trouble with the 'do nothing' option is that the British are hoping we'll do nothing.  That alone means we have to do something, and we also have to watch out for the potential use of NI to bypass restrictions on imports from the UK to the EU as agreed in the TCA.

[NANOJAMBO]

The party of "f ** k business" ...

 

U.K. manufacturers called on Prime Minister Boris Johnson’s government to stop seeing business as the enemy, as British industry calls for support in Oct. 27’s fiscal update.

 

The group Make UK said in a statement on Monday that the government needs to move on from Brexit and “end the blame game with business over the current significant challenges.” 

British businesses have battled fuel shortages, soaring energy costs, supply chain issues and labor shortages over the past few months as the U.K.’s withdrawal from the European Union and the ongoing effects of the coronavirus pandemic impact the economy.  

“Currently there is a feeling within industry that the government is still fighting the last war and sees business as the enemy within,” said Make UK Chief Executive Officer Stephen Phipson. “Business has moved on and government must do too, working in a spirit of partnership with industry to develop a longer-term economic plan which has enterprise and wealth creation as the fundamental principle.”

Conservatives have traditionally been seen as the party of business in the U.K., but relations between Johnson and companies have showed signs of fraying since Brexit. 

[Francis Albert]

For those who have always seen the Tories as the party of business is this not something to be welcomed? "Business" has always had a very hypocritical attitude to government.

[Francis Albert]

Spoiler

On 17/10/2021 at 21:41, NANOJAMBO said:

 

That time "Joe" told Johnson the US put a lot of work into the GFA and expect it to honoured.... 

 

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40718376.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

 

State Senate Presidents/Majority leaders from across the US met in Dublin to plan their response to the crisis The event preceeds the largest gathering of Irish American legislators in 100 years in the US next month to coordinate bipartizan action at state/federal levels

 

 

As Brexit tensions continue this week between the EU and UK, the launch of the American Irish State Legislators Caucus took place on Monday in Dublin's Mansion House.

State Senate Presidents and Majority leaders from across the US attended the event, with Carol Murphy, the majority leader of the New Jersey Assembly, saying it was a "great way to continue to strengthen the links between Ireland and the US and to continue to support Ireland, the Good Friday Agreement and the Peace Process."

 

The core aim of the caucus is to promote economic and political links between America and Ireland, with support for the Good Friday Agreement at the heart of the group's principles, according to a statement.

 

 

 

It is a while since I expressed my unpopular views  on the GFA. Of course it says nothing about prohibiting a border between the ROI and Northern Ireland. In fact its references to the border are about cross border matters ... in other words recognising the existence of a border. What the GFA clearly says is there shall be no change in the status of NI without a poll of the people of NI. The imposition of a border between NI and the rest of the UK is a change to the status of NI which has yet to be voted for by the people of NI. 

 

 

 

 

[Ulysses]

Because of Brexit limitations, Tesco is cancelling an arrangement where its own-brand products were sold via a supermarket chain in Finland.  Apparently they were quite popular, particularly the 'Free From' range, but they will now be replaced with products supplied by a French supermarket chain.

 

https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/news/tesco-finland-brexit-products-295670/

 

Meanwhile, M&S are to close 11 stores in France - and have signalled plans to open seven food stores in NI.

 

 

[Ked]

56 minutes ago, Ulysses said:

Because of Brexit limitations, Tesco is cancelling an arrangement where its own-brand products were sold via a supermarket chain in Finland.  Apparently they were quite popular, particularly the 'Free From' range, but they will now be replaced with products supplied by a French supermarket chain.

 

https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/news/tesco-finland-brexit-products-295670/

 

Meanwhile, M&S are to close 11 stores in France - and have signalled plans to open seven food stores in NI.

 

 

Tesco's free from range is shit.

The Finns are blessed by brexit

The French dont deserve Mark's n Sparks.

Every brexit cloud.

 

😂

 

It's about my level of anarchy.

Jkb uprising sort of thing.

What else you got ?

 

 

[Ked]

1 hour ago, Francis Albert said:

  Hide contents

 

It is a while since I expressed my unpopular views  on the GFA. Of course it says nothing about prohibiting a border between the ROI and Northern Ireland. In fact its references to the border are about cross border matters ... in other words recognising the existence of a border. What the GFA clearly says is there shall be no change in the status of NI without a poll of the people of NI. The imposition of a border between NI and the rest of the UK is a change to the status of NI which has yet to be voted for by the people of NI. 

 

 

 

 

The trouble is .

There is quite a bit of trouble about the whole thing.

[Ulysses]

1 hour ago, Ked said:

Tesco's free from range is shit.

The Finns are blessed by brexit

The French dont deserve Mark's n Sparks.

Every brexit cloud.

 

😂

 

It's about my level of anarchy.

Jkb uprising sort of thing.

What else you got ?

 

 

 

[NANOJAMBO]

5 hours ago, Francis Albert said:

For those who have always seen the Tories as the party of business is this not something to be welcomed? "Business" has always had a very hypocritical attitude to government.

In what way ?

[NANOJAMBO]

4 hours ago, Francis Albert said:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

It is a while since I expressed my unpopular views  on the GFA. Of course it says nothing about prohibiting a border between the ROI and Northern Ireland. In fact its references to the border are about cross border matters ... in other words recognising the existence of a border. What the GFA clearly says is there shall be no change in the status of NI without a poll of the people of NI. The imposition of a border between NI and the rest of the UK is a change to the status of NI which has yet to be voted for by the people of NI. 

 

 

 

 

The imposition of a border between NI and the rest of the UK is a change to the status of NI which has yet to be voted for by the people of NI... It isn't and it's not the first time it's happened. 

 

PS The MAJORITY in NI voted to stay in the EU but their wished were ignored and London imposed the sea border on them. 

 

Your  hypocricy (ignorance ?) is staggering.

[NANOJAMBO]

3 hours ago, Ulysses said:

Because of Brexit limitations, Tesco is cancelling an arrangement where its own-brand products were sold via a supermarket chain in Finland.  Apparently they were quite popular, particularly the 'Free From' range, but they will now be replaced with products supplied by a French supermarket chain.

 

https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/news/tesco-finland-brexit-products-295670/

 

Meanwhile, M&S are to close 11 stores in France - and have signalled plans to open seven food stores in NI.

 

 

The usual supects will be along shortly telling us there's no shortages, just buy something else.

For context : in a HoC committee meeting yesterday a British Retail Consortium spokesman specifically mentioned supermarket  shelves being filled with "Lynx" because they don't have the usual products and said it'll take 2-3 years to fix. 

 

Go brexit. 

[Ulysses]

5 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said:

The imposition of a border between NI and the rest of the UK is a change to the status of NI which has yet to be voted for by the people of NI... It isn't and it's not the first time it's happened.

 

Technically, the Protocol doesn't impose a border between NI and the rest of the UK.  Equally technically, it imposes a border between the rest of the UK and NI.  There are no access limitations for NI firms and individuals trying to sell into the GB market, but there is increased paperwork when GB firms and individuals want to sell into NI.

 

Politically, that border was not put in place by the EU.  It was put in place by the British government.  The EU insisted that NI had to have unrestricted access to the Single Market, without losing any access to the UK market.  The EU also wished that there would be no restrictions on access from GB to the NI market - but they could not insist on this and in the ultimate that was an internal matter of UK sovereignty.  The EU offered solutions and proposals to eliminate or minimise access issues, but all were rejected by the UK government, sometimes at the behest of the DUP in NI.

 

Legally, that border was put in place by the Parliament of the United Kingdom at Westminster.  A number of leading unionists (with the support of the major unionist parties in NI) brought a case to the NI High Court seeking to have the Protocol judicially reviewed on the grounds that it was in effect a repeal of certain provisions of the Act of Union, was contrary to the 1998 Northern Ireland Act (which gave effect to the GFA), and also was a breach of a provision of the ECHR.  The High Court found against them.  It noted that there were constitutional questions that could be addressed, but it also found that the Protocol was not unlawful because it had been approved by Parliament in the full knowledge of what it was doing and in full awareness of the existence and meaning of the Act of Union and the 1998 Act - and in UK constitutional law the will of Parliament is sovereign.  The judgment has been appealed to the Appeals Court and a hearing will take place there shortly.

 

https://www.jurist.org/news/2021/06/ni-high-court-rejects-challenge-to-northern-ireland-protocol/

 

[Ulysses]

19 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said:

The usual supects will be along shortly telling us there's no shortages, just buy something else.

For context : in a HoC committee meeting yesterday a British Retail Consortium spokesman specifically mentioned supermarket  shelves being filled with "Lynx" because they don't have the usual products and said it'll take 2-3 years to fix. 

 

Go brexit. 

 

My local Tesco didn't have their own brand thick cut marmalade last Saturday.  It's really cheap, but I really like the bitter kick from it.  Anyway, it's made in the UK, so at this stage I'm having to put it down to Brexit.  I got another variety, but it's just not the same.

 

 

[NANOJAMBO]

6 minutes ago, Ulysses said:

 

Technically, the Protocol doesn't impose a border between NI and the rest of the UK.  Equally technically, it imposes a border between the rest of the UK and NI.  There are no access limitations for NI firms and individuals trying to sell into the GB market, but there is increased paperwork when GB firms and individuals want to sell into NI

 

Legally, that border was put in place by the Parliament of the United Kingdom at Westminster.  A number of leading unionists (with the support of the major unionist parties in NI) brought a case to the NI High Court seeking to have the Protocol judicially reviewed on the grounds that it was in effect a repeal of certain provisions of the Act of Union, was contrary to the 1998 Northern Ireland Act (which gave effect to the GFA), and also was a breach of a provision of the ECHR.  The High Court found against them.  It noted that there were constitutional questions that could be addressed, but it also found that the Protocol was not unlawful because it had been approved by Parliament in the full knowledge of what it was doing and in full awareness of the existence and meaning of the Act of Union and the 1998 Act - and in UK constitutional law the will of Parliament is sovereign.  The judgment has been appealed to the Appeals Court and a hearing will take place there shortly.

 

https://www.jurist.org/news/2021/06/ni-high-court-rejects-challenge-to-northern-ireland-protocol/

 

Agreed, I was responding to FA 's  perception of a border.

My point being . there is no border being imposed now (in reality) in the Irish Sea than there was when the Unionists made their  nonsense claim the first  time *

 

*Can't recall the circumstances , maybe the 1940s ? 

It was binned by  an English judge. 

[Ulysses]

6 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said:

Agreed, I was responding to FA 's  perception of a border.

My point being . there is no border being imposed now (in reality) in the Irish Sea than there was when the Unionists made their  nonsense claim the first  time *

 

*Can't recall the circumstances , maybe the 1940s ? 

It was binned by  an English judge. 

 

I just like the idea of a one-way border. 

 

I also like the idea of a border that is very real but very invisible.  I'll cross that one four times tomorrow on my way to Donegal.

[Dennis Reynolds]

7 hours ago, Ulysses said:

 

 

Excellent

 

[Francis Albert]

8 hours ago, NANOJAMBO said:

The imposition of a border between NI and the rest of the UK is a change to the status of NI which has yet to be voted for by the people of NI... It isn't and it's not the first time it's happened. 

 

PS The MAJORITY in NI voted to stay in the EU but their wished were ignored and London imposed the sea border on them. 

 

Your  hypocricy (ignorance ?) is staggering.

There was no poll of the people of NI on Brexit. There was a UK poll the outcome of which was based on votes by the people of the UK as a whole not the people of individual parts of the UK.

 

And I did not specify who was responsible for the breach of the GFA that I claim the Irish Sea border represents.

 

If I understand your later post the "It's not the first time it has happened" above refers to smething that happened in the 1940's. I am happy to concede that that did not breach the terms of the GFA.

[Francis Albert]

.

Edited October 22, 2021 by Francis Albert

[Cade]

FA still banging on about "GFA never says the word border"

 

 

 

I wish you'd tell the UN, the USA, Ireland, Northern Ireland, the EU and UK about this staggering revelation.

That'd clear everything right up.

 

 

[Taffin]

4 hours ago, Francis Albert said:

There was no poll of the people of NI on Brexit. There was a UK poll the outcome of which was based on votes by the people of the UK as a whole not the people of individual parts of the UK.

 

And I did not specify who was responsible for the breach of the GFA that I claim the Irish Sea border represents.

 

If I understand your later post the "It's not the first time it has happened" above refers to smething that happened in the 1940's. I am happy to concede that that did not breach the terms of the GFA.

 

 

Not sure if things have changed since this article was published but it seems relevant to some of your points, particularly this part:

 

'There is no explicit commitment to never harden the border, and there is nothing about customs posts or regulatory controls.'

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-46988529.amp

 

I must admit, I'm not really clear on what it is in the GFA that prevents a border, other than potentially not being in the spirit of it. 

Edited October 22, 2021 by Taffin

[Francis Albert]

3 hours ago, Cade said:

FA still banging on about "GFA never says the word border"

 

 

 

I wish you'd tell the UN, the USA, Ireland, Northern Ireland, the EU and UK about this staggering revelation.

That'd clear everything right up.

 

 

There is a simpler way of clearing everything right up. Just quote the terms of the GFA that prohibit a border hard or soft. For some reason in all my banging on no-one has done so.

ROFL thingies don't count.

[Francis Albert]

49 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

 

Not sure if things have changed since this article was published but it seems relevant to some of your points, particularly this part:

 

'There is no explicit commitment to never harden the border, and there is nothing about customs posts or regulatory controls.'

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-46988529.amp

 

I must admit, I'm not really clear on what it is in the GFA that prevents a border, other than potentially not being in the spirit of it. 

"Not being in the spirit"and "upsetting the delicate balance of peace" are the only responses I have seen. The latter is I think code for ... If we do anything to upset the bombers they will start bombing again.

Edited October 22, 2021 by Francis Albert

[ri Alban]

50 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

 

Not sure if things have changed since this article was published but it seems relevant to some of your points, particularly this part:

 

'There is no explicit commitment to never harden the border, and there is nothing about customs posts or regulatory controls.'

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-46988529.amp

 

I must admit, I'm not really clear on what it is in the GFA that prevents a border, other than potentially not being in the spirit of it. 

If a border goes up you prevent the people who wish to be Irish from being Irish and if a border goes up between NI and GB , you prevent the people who wish to be British from being British. It's quite easy.

[Taffin]

Just now, ri Alban said:

If a border goes up you prevent the people who wish to be Irish from being Irish and if a border goes up between NI and GB , you prevent the people who wish to be British from being British. It's quite easy.

 

No you don't. They'd be Irish people living in GB, and vice versa 😂😂

 

If I moved to Germany next week, I'd still be British.

[Don Dan]

Here is the text of the Good Friday Agreement, if anyone cares to read it. 

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/136652/agreement.pdf
 

https://education.niassembly.gov.uk/post_16/snapshots_of_devolution/gfa

 

With reference to the “border” argument there is no reference to a border between the Great Britain and NI. The only reference to border is a cross-border on pages 14 and 15. This is in reference to NI and the Republic. 

[Francis Albert]

Thanks for the links.

 

The references to "cross-border" (I think the only reference to the border) clearly imply and rely on the fact that there is and will continue to be a border between NI and the ROI. The GFA is silent on the nature of that border and certainly doesn't prohibit a border.

 

There is no reference to a border between the Northern Ireland and Great Britain. Why would there be when the agreement is predicated on the assumption and agreement that NI would remain an integral part of the UK until such time as the people of NI agreed by majority vote to change that status.

 

 

Edited October 22, 2021 by Francis Albert

[Francis Albert]

1 hour ago, Taffin said:

 

No you don't. They'd be Irish people living in GB, and vice versa 😂😂

 

If I moved to Germany next week, I'd still be British.

Of course. And I will despite living most of my life in England still be be Scottish when ri Alban's dream of an independent Scotland occurs. And I will still be British. And am still European despite Brexit. 

[Taffin]

35 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

Of course. And I will despite living most of my life in England still be be Scottish when ri Alban's dream of an independent Scotland occurs. And I will still be British. And am still European despite Brexit. 

 

I'm mightily annoyed that I've lost my EU citizenship, in fact I'd argue it's an outrage others could vote that away from me...but the response to that seems to be tough titties rather than bending over backwards akin to gymnastics to keep me happy

Edited October 22, 2021 by Taffin

[Francis Albert]

6 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

I'm mightily annoyed that I've lost my EU citizenship, in fact I'd argue it's an outrage others could vote that away from me...but the response to that seems to be tough titties rather than bending over backwards akin to gymnastics to keep me happy

Fair enough. You can be mightily annoyed. As others (not me) were mightily annoyed to become EU citizens. 

 

Edited October 22, 2021 by Francis Albert

[Unknown user]

We're on the good Friday agreement? How did that ha - oh hi FA

 

https://web.archive.org/web/20170908021340/https://ec.europa.eu/commission/sites/beta-political/files/guiding-principles-dialogue-ei-ni_en.pdf

 

Here we have the EU's guiding principles on the GFA, prepared for Brexit negotiations.

 

I didn't read through much, but I did note that as co-guarantors of the agreement along with the EU and RoI, UK is committed to maintaining the peace and stability, including the avoidance of a hard border.

 

It looks like it's something that the involved parties agree is required to support the conditions needed to stick to the terms of the GFA. 

[Francis Albert]

5 minutes ago, Smithee said:

We're on the good Friday agreement? How did that ha - oh hi FA

 

https://web.archive.org/web/20170908021340/https://ec.europa.eu/commission/sites/beta-political/files/guiding-principles-dialogue-ei-ni_en.pdf

 

Here we have the EU's guiding principles on the GFA, prepared for Brexit negotiations.

 

I didn't read through much, but I did note that as co-guarantors of the agreement along with the EU and RoI, UK is committed to maintaining the peace and stability, including the avoidance of a hard border.

 

It looks like it's something that the involved parties agree is required to support the conditions needed to stick to the terms of the GFA. 

Thanks. Unfortunately the link doesn't work for me.

[Unknown user]

1 minute ago, Francis Albert said:

Thanks. Unfortunately the link doesn't work for me.

Itll be your browser preventing it, try a different one. It should open up a pdf

[Unknown user]

web.pdf

[Francis Albert]

10 minutes ago, Smithee said:

web.pdf 478.51 kB · 10 downloads

Thanks. Got it now and will read it. 

 

 

[Don Dan]

27 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

I didn't read through much

Very much like Boris Johnson who probably didn’t understand what he did manage to read. He be to busy pumping Carrie to be bother with mere details like important texts in the agreement. 

[Unknown user]

25 minutes ago, Boy Daniel said:

Very much like Boris Johnson who probably didn’t understand what he did manage to read. He be to busy pumping Carrie to be bother with mere details like important texts in the agreement. 

 

Like Boris, I wasn't that arsed, I just wondered why there was such a disparity - everyone says something but no-one can say where it came from

[Boof]

16 hours ago, Ulysses said:

 

I just like the idea of a one-way border. 

 

 

Bit like a turnstile?

[Francis Albert]

5 hours ago, Smithee said:

web.pdf 478.51 kB · 23 downloads

Thank you. I have read it. It is a statement of the EU's position on the Brexit negotiations in relation to the Irish question including the border issue. Which is fair enough though clearly partial. It does not really address the point I "bang on about" ... the oft repeated assertion that a border would breach the terms of the GFA. The closest it comes is to say a "hard border"  (which is not defined) would be inconsistent with the GFA (whether by letter or "in spirit" is unclear). 

 

 

 

Edited October 22, 2021 by Francis Albert

[Cade]

Lots of councils in England now saying that refuse collections are under threat.

All their bin lorry drivers have fecked off to the supermarkets as they've put wages up.

 

Councils can't put wages up to compete, especially not with more local council cuts looming in the next budget.

 

So all we've done is re-arrange the deckchairs.

[Gizmo]

2 hours ago, Cade said:

Lots of councils in England now saying that refuse collections are under threat.

All their bin lorry drivers have fecked off to the supermarkets as they've put wages up.

 

Councils can't put wages up to compete, especially not with more local council cuts looming in the next budget.

 

So all we've done is re-arrange the deckchairs.

 

At least Supermarket shelves are full again  

 

[Enzo Chiefo]

5 hours ago, Cade said:

Lots of councils in England now saying that refuse collections are under threat.

All their bin lorry drivers have fecked off to the supermarkets as they've put wages up.

 

Councils can't put wages up to compete, especially not with more local council cuts looming in the next budget.

 

So all we've done is re-arrange the deckchairs.

Have you heard about the planned refuse workers strike in the trash ridden, rat infested Glasgow? Why the feck are you worrying about English councils??

[jamboy1982]

25 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Have you heard about the planned refuse workers strike in the trash ridden, rat infested Glasgow? Why the feck are you worrying about English councils??

Probably because this is a thread about brexit and the impacts it is having on the whole of the uk. Why are you so desperate to turn a harmless comment round to have a dig at Scotland? 
 

Sad life sitting on kickback all day having pops at Scotland and the Scottish government. Maybe get a new hobbie? 

[Enzo Chiefo]

2 minutes ago, jamboy1982 said:

Probably because this is a thread about brexit and the impacts it is having on the whole of the uk. Why are you so desperate to turn a harmless comment round to have a dig at Scotland? 
 

Sad life sitting on kickback all day having pops at Scotland and the Scottish government. Maybe get a new hobbie? 

Certainly not a hobby. Check my post count, pal. Barely on the board.👍.

Just seems a bit weird to be worrying about English councils when exactly the same issues are happening here. Incidentally,  it is feck all to do with Brexit, all European countries have driver shortages.

[Nucky Thompson]

Never had a problem getting fuel or getting anything I wanted from the supermarket.

 

Remainiacs, you're desperate 

[NANOJAMBO]

On 22/10/2021 at 10:17, Francis Albert said:

There was no poll of the people of NI on Brexit. There was a UK poll the outcome of which was based on votes by the people of the UK as a whole not the people of individual parts of the UK.

 

And I did not specify who was responsible for the breach of the GFA that I claim the Irish Sea border represents.

 

If I understand your later post the "It's not the first time it has happened" above refers to smething that happened in the 1940's. I am happy to concede that that did not breach the terms of the GFA.

But you obviously get the point. 

 

PS Your pointless allusion to the 19040s & the GFA is just that : pointless. 

[NANOJAMBO]

47 minutes ago, jamboy1982 said:

Probably because this is a thread about brexit and the impacts it is having on the whole of the uk. Why are you so desperate to turn a harmless comment round to have a dig at Scotland? 
 

Sad life sitting on kickback all day having pops at Scotland and the Scottish government. Maybe get a new hobbie? 

He hates the idea of independence.