Ann Budge update

[FarmerTweedy]

It was an analysis of who got the best out of the Bidco/FoH agreement. You may disagree but it wasn't "bitter bullshit" towards Ann to whom we should all be grateful. And she was perfectly entitled to get the deal she did.

 

People since I posted that have consistently confused facts with "vile things" said about Ann.

 

It was bitter bullshit. The deal she's done at best ensures that she's not likely to be worse off financially to any significant degree than if she'd never got involved in the first place and had kept her money invested as it was before she got involved. You're absolutely right that she was entitled to get that deal, yet you keep bringing the deal up again and again, pretty much shouting 'REMEMBER THE DEAL SHE GOT, REMEMBER THE DEAL SHE GOT, REMEMBER THE DEAL SHE GOT', when there's absolutely no reason for you to be going on about it. The only reason there can be for you bringing it up at pretty much any opportunity is if you're not happy with it, and want to try to generate discontent about it among other people.  If you were happy about it, you'd shut up about it.  And it's not the fact you're unhappy about it and keep going on about it that pisses me off, it's the fact that you go on about it and then pretend that you're not unhappy about it.  Be honest about it instead of being a shit-stirring fraud!

[socrates82]

There's an obvious willingness, even eagerness, from a group of the same people on here to repeatedly try to discredit and slag off their own football club, and they go to great lengths to do it.

 

It's weird.

 

There was another guy who went to great lengths to do that during the romanov era. Sergy something... at least he was a hibee though

[FarmerTweedy]

Well on the first the fact is "yes she is". She is getting the same interest which does indeed amount to about ?700k but now over 7 years not 5. In return for FoH gifting another ?3m she made her "personal contribution" of waiving two years interest. Of course the resulting new stand will substantially increase the value of her retained 17.4% interest by more than the ?300,000 deferred interest.

 

Its good to have a financialy acute Chirman/CEO.

 

Her 17.4% interest will, in reality, not be worth very much.  With FoH owning a controlling interest, there will be little or no point in anyone else buying her shares with a view to taking control, and the club won't be run with the intention of generating a financial return for shareholders in the form of dividends.  Therefore, if she decides to sell her shareholding at any point, it's highly unlikely to attract the sort of sale price that you seem to think it might.  Given that she's financially astute (which I assume you meant rather than acute!) she'll be aware of this herself.

 

As for having to wait an extra two years to get her loan paid back, and receiving no additional interest for that delay, the likelihood is that she'll lose out substantially due to missing out on potential investment returns that she could have received if she'd got that money back when originally agreed rather than when she will under the new agreement.

[FarmerTweedy]

He wasn't talking about that though, he's just saying that rich people aren't having to get by on a mere 2.5% Apr

 

Not just rich people.  I'm not rich by any means (comfortable is how I'd describe my situation!) but the funds that my pension is invested in have gone up in value by over 25% over the last 15 months or so, and they're by no means high-risk funds!

[mac]

It's great being my age and thinking I know everything

With respect John, and as an old goat, it really is only young people who think they know everything   

[Debut 4]

Looking forward to the game tomorrow.

 

This is about football isn't it?

I thought so too.

 

It's funny on here sometimes but not always in a good way.

[Alex Kintner]

.

[Alex Kintner]

The new stand should be a monument to all those who put their hands in their pockets to save the club we love. It's a permanent symbol of what we can achieve when we stand united.

 

Then there's this thread...

[Jamos]

Strange username FootballFirst, maybe a change to HypotheticalFinanceFirst is in order, he should head out to singles night in Asda one Wednesday evening with FA, they would have a rip roaring time together those two. They could discuss compliance, make figures up and discuss them between themselves in the cold isle to ensure nothing gets too out of hand

[ramrod]

Oh FFS.

The changes may or may not add value. The fact is they weren't apparently deemed necessary initially and certainly weren't budgeted for.

This takes blind worship to a new level.

 

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

All this talk of budgets and over spends is all very Hibs imo

I'm reasonably sure we will come through this debt free in a few years with a magnificent new main stand .

As the building progress we are seeing an opportunity to improve it , this costs extra , that's the reality and I'm happy to go along with it . He

[luckydug]

Strange username FootballFirst, maybe a change to HypotheticalFinanceFirst is in order, he should head out to singles night in Asda one Wednesday evening with FA, they would have a rip roaring time together those two. They could discuss compliance, make figures up and discuss them between themselves in the cold isle to ensure nothing gets too out of hand

I really don't understand the mindset of these folk.

Not you Jamos. I mean you know who.

[Jamos]

I really don't understand the mindset of these folk.

Not you Jamos. I mean you know who.

 

Its fine Dug, you are probably right about me too

[tolcross lad]

Strange username FootballFirst, maybe a change to HypotheticalFinanceFirst is in order, he should head out to singles night in Asda one Wednesday evening with FA, they would have a rip roaring time together those two. They could discuss compliance, make figures up and discuss them between themselves in the cold isle to ensure nothing gets too out of hand

FF and FA try to bring clarity on the clubs and FOHs financial matters and governance.FA can be like a dog with a bone when roused but I have always appreciated their contributions.It is necessary that some pick up on the detail of these issues and they do just that.They are open to criticism and challenge.So people can make of it what they will.

I support Ann Budge.With the support of the fans she has been the major factor in resurrecting our club and I have no problems with her getting rewards.If and its a big if we are hitting some financial difficulty in financing the new stand to the detriment of the playing side I would want this sorted and I am sure Ann will have ideas.I am one who thinks that she has been let down by the performance of the DOF.

I remember a quote of Bobby Parker appointed to the Board in 1970 when he observed 2 of the directors asleep during a Board meeting.We all know what happened in the 70s.Whoever is in charge of our club should be subject to scrutiny and be strong enough to handle strong criticism even its only on a fans forum.

[Unknown user]

FF and FA try to bring clarity on the clubs and FOHs financial matters and governance.FA can be like a dog with a bone when roused but I have always appreciated their contributions.It is necessary that some pick up on the detail of these issues and they do just that.They are open to criticism and challenge.So people can make of it what they will.

I support Ann Budge.With the support of the fans she has been the major factor in resurrecting our club and I have no problems with her getting rewards.If and its a big if we are hitting some financial difficulty in financing the new stand to the detriment of the playing side I would want this sorted and I am sure Ann will have ideas.I am one who thinks that she has been let down by the performance of the DOF.

I remember a quote of Bobby Parker appointed to the Board in 1970 when he observed 2 of the directors asleep during a Board meeting.We all know what happened in the 70s.Whoever is in charge of our club should be subject to scrutiny and be strong enough to handle strong criticism even its only on a fans forum.

Good post, well said

[Bad Religion]

FF and FA try to bring clarity on the clubs and FOHs financial matters and governance.FA can be like a dog with a bone when roused but I have always appreciated their contributions.It is necessary that some pick up on the detail of these issues and they do just that.They are open to criticism and challenge.So people can make of it what they will.

I support Ann Budge.With the support of the fans she has been the major factor in resurrecting our club and I have no problems with her getting rewards.If and its a big if we are hitting some financial difficulty in financing the new stand to the detriment of the playing side I would want this sorted and I am sure Ann will have ideas.I am one who thinks that she has been let down by the performance of the DOF.

I remember a quote of Bobby Parker appointed to the Board in 1970 when he observed 2 of the directors asleep during a Board meeting.We all know what happened in the 70s.Whoever is in charge of our club should be subject to scrutiny and be strong enough to handle strong criticism even its only on a fans forum.

I assume there's a reason why there's no separate FOH governance thread.

[wavydavy]

Good post, well said

 

Agree.

[mitch41]

Mitch,

 

I think you may have misinterpreted my post. (Or I am misinterpreting yours).

 

I wasn't meaning that as a negative towards Ann Budge. Quite the opposite.

 

I meant my previous post sarcastically.

 

I was suggesting that others will have put the cost plan together and I am sure if there was an unplanned over run she would have been as disappointed as anyone. It would not have been within her control as she would have employed others to accurately provide this information.

 

If some of it's through choice I am sure it's with good intentions and benefit to the club.

 

Some seem keen to lay the blame directly with her for any budget overun and seem to be suggesting she personally made a mess of the budget, whereas sometimes you have to rely on others and mistakes can happen.

 

I have full trust she will be dealing with any issues in the best way possible.

 

[emoji106]

 

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

oops i wasn't having a go at you when i said 'when you have a go at" i ment when people have a go. Sorry.

[Des Lynam]

Strange username FootballFirst, maybe a change to HypotheticalFinanceFirst is in order, he should head out to singles night in Asda one Wednesday evening with FA, they would have a rip roaring time together those two. They could discuss compliance, make figures up and discuss them between themselves in the cold isle to ensure nothing gets too out of hand

[Gigolo-Aunt]

I just want a successful team that won't bankrupt the club.

 

 

Here here.

[Footballfirst]

Last post .... promise

 

Dear Great Leader of JKB Groupthink

 

O Great Leader, I have sinned.  I have besmirched the good name of the Supreme Leader.

 

• I have lied
• I have misrepresented
• I have been disingenuous
• I have an agenda
• I have criticised by innuendo
• I have posted bullshit
• I have even presented numbers in a way that doesn't conform to accounting standards FFS

 

I am unworthy. Please forgive me. I humbly apologise for my failings. I seek your clemency. I promise not to question anything in the future about our Supreme Leader, the Grand Palace (under construction), or the Great Banker of the Legions.

 

Your humble servant

Footballfirst.

[graygo]

Last post .... promise

 

Dear Great Leader of JKB Groupthink

 

O Great Leader, I have sinned.  I have besmirched the good name of the Supreme Leader.

 

• I have lied
• I have misrepresented
• I have been disingenuous
• I have an agenda
• I have criticised by innuendo
• I have posted bullshit
• I have even presented numbers in a way that doesn't conform to accounting standards FFS

 

I am unworthy. Please forgive me. I humbly apologise for my failings. I seek your clemency. I promise not to question anything in the future about our Supreme Leader, the Grand Palace (under construction), or the Great Banker of the Legions.

 

Your humble servant

Footballfirst.

 

Seems fair enough, takes a big man to admit he has wronged.

 

Edit: Forgot the smiley  

[Boab]

Thank the lord it's match day.

 

Bye !

[scott herbertson]

Last post .... promise

 

Dear Great Leader of JKB Groupthink

 

O Great Leader, I have sinned.  I have besmirched the good name of the Supreme Leader.

 

 

• I have lied
• I have misrepresented
• I have been disingenuous
• I have an agenda
• I have criticised by innuendo
• I have posted bullshit
• I have even presented numbers in a way that doesn't conform to accounting standards FFS

 

I am unworthy. Please forgive me. I humbly apologise for my failings. I seek your clemency. I promise not to question anything in the future about our Supreme Leader, the Grand Palace (under construction), or the Great Banker of the Legions.

 

Your humble servant

Footballfirst.

Lol

 

This thread needed a big of humour

[Boab]

Lol

 

This thread needed a big of humour

 

I've laughed all the way through it, personally !

[151]

This must be one of the saddest post in regard to this subject.

 

A poster who has made a complete ****** up on this thread still trying to wriggle his way out of it.

 

He might well be a respected poster on other threads but on this he is showing himself to be badly out of touch with the fans and getting more and more desperate as he is no longer the favoured one on JKB

 

You are badly in need of a rethink and an admission you are simply wrong might get you out of the hole you are digging with each post you make

 

Car crash of a post. He has came up with a way of building a stand without potentially going over budget by 3-4m and said he hopes it works out nonetheless.

 

I don't think there is anyone out there who cares about their reputation on "threads" on JKB. Do grown men really care about an internet forum that much?

 

The way you get treated for thinking Ann Budge is maybe a bit out of touch is unreal on here

[john5698]

With respect John, and as an old goat, it really is only young people who think they know everything   

Mac, my kids were telling me so last night at my daughter's birthday party

[redjambo]

 

Car crash of a post. He has came up with a way of building a stand without potentially going over budget by 3-4m and said he hopes it works out nonetheless.

 

I don't think there is anyone out there who cares about their reputation on "threads" on JKB. Do grown men really care about an internet forum that much?

 

The way you get treated for thinking Ann Budge is maybe a bit out of touch is unreal on here

 

And women! Sexist.

[redjambo]

Last post .... promise

 

Dear Great Leader of JKB Groupthink

 

O Great Leader, I have sinned.  I have besmirched the good name of the Supreme Leader.

 

• I have lied
• I have misrepresented
• I have been disingenuous
• I have an agenda
• I have criticised by innuendo
• I have posted bullshit
• I have even presented numbers in a way that doesn't conform to accounting standards FFS

 

I am unworthy. Please forgive me. I humbly apologise for my failings. I seek your clemency. I promise not to question anything in the future about our Supreme Leader, the Grand Palace (under construction), or the Great Banker of the Legions.

 

Your humble servant

Footballfirst.

 

Thank you for your confession, FF.

 

Say three Hail Ann's, put ?3 million in the confession box, and don't do it again!

[Unknown user]

Three hail Ann's

[i wish jj was my dad]

Even though it's extremely selective and highly misleading?

Does it matter if it allows people to have a pop at the club, AB or CL?

[AndyMcI]

oops i wasn't having a go at you when i said 'when you have a go at" i ment when people have a go. Sorry.

All good Mitch [emoji106]

 

I was posting from my phone with original post and don't think my sarcasm was as obvious as it was meant to be as it didn't attach any smileys. [emoji85]

 

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

[Seymour M Hersh]

Lol

 

This thread needed a big of humour

 

Agreed. But when are we going to get some?

[archieauld]

Perception and rumours are serious considerations to anyone involved in finance or markets - and football.  A sniff of a rumour is always noted.

?A huge percentage of what is churned and regurgitated in the media (which moulds and drives the public mindset with alarming power, especially amongst the non-discerning public fodder) - comes from trawling social media.

?In 2013 - Hearts had debts of around ?28.5 million and 200 creditors.  Ann Budge - was moved hugely by love of Hearts and despite warnings of astute and sensible business peers regarding the known risks of involvement in football clubs i.e. don't touch them with a bargepole - she stepped up to the plate and pledged herself as collateral in the real situation of a club going into administration and the possibility of wipe-out.

?2016 - the club is declared debt-free with some ?623,000 profit and having gained a massive respect and acknowledgement from the entire football world for the commitment of its supporters, Foundation of Hearts etc , a team who in the first dodgy year displayed enormous and enviable spirit with any number of other clubs and supporters envious and admiring of all of that.  Then the football side of things staggered downwards - and we are where we are - weathering a number of things which though vital - are not circumstances which signal apocalypse.

?The transit timetable for stadium seats - big deal.  Other things needing ironed out for the completion of the stadium - so what.  Everything in the global business arena is all over the place at the moment and waiting a couple of months longer for a completed stadium in the great scheme of things - is hardly an indication of endemic failure by the club.  These things happen with infrastructure projects all over the world all the time - and more than you would imagine in the UK for major public events which don't make it into the media or the public awareness - and the world doesn't end because of it.

?What could be a problem of perception which fans flames - is rumour and tone of rumours.  The most dangerous and damaging scenario for any business is rumours questioning the credibility, honesty, motivations and capabilities of business owners, their board, their management team and all invested in the business.  In football - the supporter 'tone' and megaphoning of negatives - substantiated or not substantiated - fan the flames of rumour, the old 'there's no smoke without fire' perception.   Supporter 'dissatisfaction' - rumour of shareholder concerns regarding the club management and finances - are noted by the social media and gossip trawlers - and are easily picked up by players, benefactors, donors, manager candidates and any outriders considering or already affiliated or hoping to be involved with the club at any business level, large or small, sponsors, potential sponsors, local dignitaries and individuals who may be attracted to potentially increasing their client base through making use of the new stand etc.

?HMFC has a new stand in the making and near completion.  HMFC needs consistent commercial support - as well as to maintain and expand what is an excellent and mostly discerning and intelligent supporter base which has put its money where its mouth is for the club and of course themselves.  A new Head Coach will be appointed - the management structure is being scrutinised with the future in mind.  A club which spots negatives and advises it is taking a refresh look - is much more trustworthy and sensible if it continually makes adjustments as time goes on in response to changes in effectiveness.

?Reading some of the comments on this forum - no complaint about the nature of them at all - but there is a creeping negativity and rumour element to implying a lack of credibility in Ann Budge - which is very very very serious no matter at what level it is expressed.  Ann Budge's past business reputation is still the club's main collateral for attracting business to the club and for the initial financial body response to her having that excellent credible background as a guarantor back in 2013 to save the club.  She passed that test specifically for being Ann Budge with a considerable stable renown in business.  

?Any rumours - substantiated or not - credible or not credible - regarding the credibility of Ann Budge and the board of HMFC - particularly with claims of lack of integrity regarding finances - is very bad perception messaging to be simmering away on a very well known forum such as this.

?Perception in business and politics - is everything.  It makes or breaks.

Just a thought to bear in mind.



 

[Francis Albert]

Fortunately there have been no claims of lack of integrity regarding finances and I am sure responsible business people will not invent or imagine such claims as some on here have. If there are any grounds for anyone questioning Ann or the Board's credibility Ann created them with her first statement on the delay of the first phase of the stand.

[i wish jj was my dad]

Perception and rumours are serious considerations to anyone involved in finance or markets - and football. A sniff of a rumour is always noted.

 

?A huge percentage of what is churned and regurgitated in the media (which moulds and drives the public mindset with alarming power, especially amongst the non-discerning public fodder) - comes from trawling social media.

 

?In 2013 - Hearts had debts of around ?28.5 million and 200 creditors. Ann Budge - was moved hugely by love of Hearts and despite warnings of astute and sensible business peers regarding the known risks of involvement in football clubs i.e. don't touch them with a bargepole - she stepped up to the plate and pledged herself as collateral in the real situation of a club going into administration and the possibility of wipe-out.

 

?2016 - the club is declared debt-free with some ?623,000 profit and having gained a massive respect and acknowledgement from the entire football world for the commitment of its supporters, Foundation of Hearts etc , a team who in the first dodgy year displayed enormous and enviable spirit with any number of other clubs and supporters envious and admiring of all of that. Then the football side of things staggered downwards - and we are where we are - weathering a number of things which though vital - are not circumstances which signal apocalypse.

 

?The transit timetable for stadium seats - big deal. Other things needing ironed out for the completion of the stadium - so what. Everything in the global business arena is all over the place at the moment and waiting a couple of months longer for a completed stadium in the great scheme of things - is hardly an indication of endemic failure by the club. These things happen with infrastructure projects all over the world all the time - and more than you would imagine in the UK for major public events which don't make it into the media or the public awareness - and the world doesn't end because of it.

 

?What could be a problem of perception which fans flames - is rumour and tone of rumours. The most dangerous and damaging scenario for any business is rumours questioning the credibility, honesty, motivations and capabilities of business owners, their board, their management team and all invested in the business. In football - the supporter 'tone' and megaphoning of negatives - substantiated or not substantiated - fan the flames of rumour, the old 'there's no smoke without fire' perception. Supporter 'dissatisfaction' - rumour of shareholder concerns regarding the club management and finances - are noted by the social media and gossip trawlers - and are easily picked up by players, benefactors, donors, manager candidates and any outriders considering or already affiliated or hoping to be involved with the club at any business level, large or small, sponsors, potential sponsors, local dignitaries and individuals who may be attracted to potentially increasing their client base through making use of the new stand etc.

 

?HMFC has a new stand in the making and near completion. HMFC needs consistent commercial support - as well as to maintain and expand what is an excellent and mostly discerning and intelligent supporter base which has put its money where its mouth is for the club and of course themselves. A new Head Coach will be appointed - the management structure is being scrutinised with the future in mind. A club which spots negatives and advises it is taking a refresh look - is much more trustworthy and sensible if it continually makes adjustments as time goes on in response to changes in effectiveness.

 

?Reading some of the comments on this forum - no complaint about the nature of them at all - but there is a creeping negativity and rumour element to implying a lack of credibility in Ann Budge - which is very very very serious no matter at what level it is expressed. Ann Budge's past business reputation is still the club's main collateral for attracting business to the club and for the initial financial body response to her having that excellent credible background as a guarantor back in 2013 to save the club. She passed that test specifically for being Ann Budge with a considerable stable renown in business.

 

?Any rumours - substantiated or not - credible or not credible - regarding the credibility of Ann Budge and the board of HMFC - particularly with claims of lack of integrity regarding finances - is very bad perception messaging to be simmering away on a very well known forum such as this.

 

?Perception in business and politics - is everything. It makes or breaks.

 

Just a thought to bear in mind.

 

 

 

 

great post. I wish the trouble makers would heed.

[Francis Albert]

great post. I wish the trouble makers would heed.

great post. I wish the trouble makers would heed.

it isn't a great post. It is possibly the greatest pile of drivel i have read on here. Speaking as one who has contbuted his fair share!

[i wish jj was my dad]

it isn't a great post. It is possibly the greatest pile of drivel i have read on here. Speaking as one who has contbuted his fair share!

I agree with your final sentence

[Francis Albert]

I agree with your final sentence

What about the second sentence? What caused the greatest damage to Ann's credibility? A statement that the delay in the first phase of the new stand was "beyond our control" and was to do with bad weather in Edinburgh and shipping delays. Followed the next day with a statement that we had failed to order the seats.

Or was it people posting on a message board, none of them claiming as you suggested a lack of financial integrity?

[i wish jj was my dad]

What about the second sentence? What caused the greatest damage to Ann's credibility? A statement that the delay in the first phase of the new stand was "beyond our control" and was to do with bad weather in Edinburgh and shipping delays. Followed the next day with a statement that we had failed to order the seats.

Or was it people posting on a message board, none of them claiming as you suggested a lack of financial integrity?

What I worry about with AB is that she walks away and leaves us to run the club without her. If she lacked credibility or integrity we wouldn't be here now. Why people try to find some angle to suggest she has another agenda is beyond mem