Jeremy Corbyn

[Rudy T]

 

 

 

 

 

 

If any Tory actually believes that Teresa May gives a flying feck about the poor , less well off or those in poverty then they are a fantasist of the first order .

So whats the answer?

 

I'm pro union but not necessarily a staunch Tory voter. As it stands today come the GE I will vote Tory and ill tell you why because I can see no viable alternative. I don't agree with all they do or every single one of their policies but I identify with them more than any other party at present.

 

I thought the SNP could provide a strong government for Scotland after the referendum was decided. They simply haven't they plough on relentlessly for indyref2 to the detriment of the country.

 

Since the referendum Europe and the UK has changed and the challenges facing independence are greater than ever. I just do not hear anything from the Nats other than anti tory rhetoric to suggest they have the faintest idea what to do if they get a yes vote from indyref2. I'm honestly open to hearing their plans and ideas if they are viable I'd give it serious consideration until then there's only one show in town.

[John Findlay]

The days he is harking back to never existed in the first place

The working poor rammed into poor housing, terrible facilities, outside loos, many kids to one room- they lived in slums

Now Corbyn is trying to attract the votes of people who have 3 bedroom semi's , cars and a wee foreign jaunt once a year and a bedroom for each kid

Its a different type of poor

You are correct upto a point.

One big difference nowadas. Is that the more those that are classed as poor get. The more they shout they are worse off.

Back in the 70s. Most of those called working class. Wanted to do that work. Now there is a large percentage who believe the state owe them a living. Which is wrong regardless of your politics. Alas those are the people Corbyn is pandering too and that is why he and his party are on a hiding to nothing.

[doctor jambo]

You are correct upto a point.

One big difference nowadas. Is that the more those that are classed as poor get. The more they shout they are worse off.

Back in the 70s. Most of those called working class. Wanted to do that work. Now there is a large percentage who believe the state owe them a living. Which is wrong regardless of your politics. Alas those are the people Corbyn is pandering too and that is why he and his party are on a hiding to nothing.

Indeed - the party has shifted from the "working class" to the "not working class"

Those working now have far more in common with the middle classes than those out of work.

The Conservatives with low tax and high employment appeal far more to those in work that a "hike the tax and spunk it all over the place" that corbyn is associated with

[John Findlay]

Indeed - the party has shifted from the "working class" to the "not working class"

Those working now have far more in common with the middle classes than those out of work.

The Conservatives with low tax and high employment appeal far more to those in work that a "hike the tax and spunk it all over the place" that corbyn is associated with

Agreed. But there are those that call that selfish. When IMHO it is nothing of the sort.

[doctor jambo]

Agreed. But there are those that call that selfish. When IMHO it is nothing of the sort.

I have often felt a little mystified by Scotland trying to define itself as some kind of paragon of socialist virtue,

when scots are, if anything, naturally more Conservative- frugal, independent, self reliant, hard working

[John Findlay]

I have often felt a little mystified by Scotland trying to define itself as some kind of paragon of socialist virtue,

when scots are, if anything, naturally more Conservative- frugal, independent, self reliant, hard working

We were. We are losing alot of the above now.

 

Not sure we will ever get it back.

[Maroon Sailor]

Fair play to him for taking the ' strong and stable ' bananas prank in good spirit

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/05/08/jeremy-corbyn-offered-strong-stable-bananas-campaign-trail/

[Boris]

I have often felt a little mystified by Scotland trying to define itself as some kind of paragon of socialist virtue,

when scots are, if anything, naturally more Conservative- frugal, independent, self reliant, hard working

But also mindful of those less fortunate and more willing to help?

 

The above comments, effectively denouncing scroungers, are valid, however equating everyone on benefit with scroungers is exactly the narrative the Tories are happy to grow and be the common misconception.

[doctor jambo]

But also mindful of those less fortunate and more willing to help?

 

The above comments, effectively denouncing scroungers, are valid, however equating everyone on benefit with scroungers is exactly the narrative the Tories are happy to grow and be the common misconception.

When the state removed the responsibility for looking after our sick/elderly/disabled/ unemployed relatives and children from ourselves as part of a larger socialist model it was not necessarily a good thing.

The state took all that on , and hiked spending and tax to cover it all, little thinking that when this all became unaffordable , the taxation burden on everyone now makes it impossible to look after all these folks by their own relatives.

Big state has removed the onus from people to look after their own

Free school meals for all in early primaries being a prime example- the kids of millionaires being fed by working poor tax ?

The medications of the rich being funded by the same source

Rail fares and bus passes same

total madness

[Boris]

When the state removed the responsibility for looking after our sick/elderly/disabled/ unemployed relatives and children from ourselves as part of a larger socialist model it was not necessarily a good thing.

The state took all that on , and hiked spending and tax to cover it all, little thinking that when this all became unaffordable , the taxation burden on everyone now makes it impossible to look after all these folks by their own relatives.

Big state has removed the onus from people to look after their own

Free school meals for all in early primaries being a prime example- the kids of millionaires being fed by working poor tax ?

The medications of the rich being funded by the same source

Rail fares and bus passes same

total madness

 

And why did it become unaffordable?  Priorities good Dr, priorities.

[I P Knightley]

Corbyn saying he will stay as leader even if he gets decimated in the forthcoming GE

 

What would be the point ?

He's got previous for turning a rubber ear towards credible calls that something is significantly wrong. He won't take a mashing from the electorate as any sort of message that he maybe ought to consider alternative points of view. 

 

At one point, I was just about willing to accept him on the basis that having a bumbling fool in office not knowing what to do next would be a better alternative to having May & Co actively working to damage the health and education services in the country. However, Corbyn's complete lack of judgement and awareness would be an equal disaster. I find myself in the same frame of mind as the lead up to a Celtic v Rangers match. I want them both to lose.

[doctor jambo]

And why did it become unaffordable?  Priorities good Dr, priorities.

Inform me please Boris as I'm at a loss myself

In these days of increased spending in education and Health- with the staffing costs NOT rising as we are all pay goosed so our wages have fallen 20% over the last 10 years where has all the money that enters these services gone?

Its not on the staff and its not on the kids so where?

I suspect the answer is that at least in the NHS we are all so busy covering our backs, filling in accident reports over the most inconsequential little things and writing endless screeds of notes to cover our backs in case of error at any point , and having someone review all these things and develop action plans, then deliver it all, that no-one can actually get any real work done.

Example- recently it was a long weekend and Doc on duty only made up medication tray until the Monday, not the Tuesday.

Nurse datixed it- took them an hour to fill in the forms and sent it to her manager, who reviewed this- another hour, then emailed senior Doc, who read it, then cascaded it to the other docs who looked at it and drew up an action plan to prevent it happening again ( another few hours)

In the "old days" nurse on Monday would have simply called MOnday doc to box up another 24 hrs meds- 2 minute job- but the new way means 6 hours + of clinical time lost on a futile exercise

This kind of mental torture is going on all the time.......

[elvoys]

Phillip Hammond attended a rally at the start of the month addressing skin headed fascists under the Nazi banner and portraits of Hitler.

 

Oh wait, that was actually McDonnell under the hammer and sickle and Stalins mug. Prob being a bit harsh on Hitler tbh seeing as old Joe outdid his camp toll by X5.

 

Honestly, what will it take to get away from the harmless old garden Gnome schtick that folks send his way? Between him, McDonnell and Abbot they have attended Hezbollah marches, been sacked by Red Ken for being too left, called Hamas 'friends', openly supported IRA and said Labour members not doing so deserved to be knee capped, hosted Sinn Fein the week after near assasination of the PM and said Chairman Mao did 'more good than harm'.

 

An absolute moral disgrace that mob. Spare me the decent old values snash.

[coconut doug]

You are correct upto a point.

One big difference nowadas. Is that the more those that are classed as poor get. The more they shout they are worse off.

Back in the 70s. Most of those called working class. Wanted to do that work. Now there is a large percentage who believe the state owe them a living. Which is wrong regardless of your politics. Alas those are the people Corbyn is pandering too and that is why he and his party are on a hiding to nothing.

I don't hear the poor shouting much about anything. Who gives them a platform and who listens to them anyway. Wealth and living standards can be measured so we know that people are getting poorer. In work poverty is a big problem now. There is no large percentage of people thinking the state owes them a living in my experience. Unemployment has rarely if ever been lower.

[coconut doug]

Indeed - the party has shifted from the "working class" to the "not working class"

Those working now have far more in common with the middle classes than those out of work.

The Conservatives with low tax and high employment appeal far more to those in work that a "hike the tax and spunk it all over the place" that corbyn is associated with

Until they get ill obviously. Thought you might pick up on that given your claim to be a doctor.

[Dawnrazor]

The Shadow Education Secretary screws up the figures on how many children will be effected by Labours policy, after Dianne Abbots job?

[coconut doug]

I have often felt a little mystified by Scotland trying to define itself as some kind of paragon of socialist virtue,

when scots are, if anything, naturally more Conservative- frugal, independent, self reliant, hard working

So you have diagnosed a congenital predisposition to conservatism, frugality, independence and hard working self reliance amongst Scots and suggest that these characteristics are at odds with "socialist virtue" 

 I'm not sure what socialist virtue is in your mind but I'm certain that Socialism includes those qualities you quoted as well as the best attributes of humanity. This contrasts significantly with the self interest and greed frequently espoused by you. Perhaps if you had to sell your skills on the open market you might find things less lucrative and value more the society you live in. You have a big salary because our society values the health of all it's citizens. That I believe is part of socialist virtue.

[JamboX2]

To cap it all their Manifesto has been leaked.

 

I wonder who would do such a thing.

Tbf the Party seem happy with this. A couple of papers bigging it up as decent without any issues around Corbyn presenting it.

 

On the headlines from it: I'm pretty for it myself.

[coconut doug]

Phillip Hammond attended a rally at the start of the month addressing skin headed fascists under the Nazi banner and portraits of Hitler.

 

Oh wait, that was actually McDonnell under the hammer and sickle and Stalins mug. Prob being a bit harsh on Hitler tbh seeing as old Joe outdid his camp toll by X5.

 

Honestly, what will it take to get away from the harmless old garden Gnome schtick that folks send his way? Between him, McDonnell and Abbot they have attended Hezbollah marches, been sacked by Red Ken for being too left, called Hamas 'friends', openly supported IRA and said Labour members not doing so deserved to be knee capped, hosted Sinn Fein the week after near assasination of the PM and said Chairman Mao did 'more good than harm'.

 

An absolute moral disgrace that mob. Spare me the decent old values snash.

 

Phillip Hammond attended a rally at the start of the month addressing skin headed fascists under the Nazi banner and portraits of Hitler.

 

Oh wait, that was actually McDonnell under the hammer and sickle and Stalins mug. Prob being a bit harsh on Hitler tbh seeing as old Joe outdid his camp toll by X5.

 

Honestly, what will it take to get away from the harmless old garden Gnome schtick that folks send his way? Between him, McDonnell and Abbot they have attended Hezbollah marches, been sacked by Red Ken for being too left, called Hamas 'friends', openly supported IRA and said Labour members not doing so deserved to be knee capped, hosted Sinn Fein the week after near assasination of the PM and said Chairman Mao did 'more good than harm'.

 

An absolute moral disgrace that mob. Spare me the decent old values snash.

Corbyn's no promoter of violence. You're mixing him up with Blair. What will it take to get you to realise that over a million Iraqis are dead and countless others had their lives destroyed because of strong and stable leadership. Corbyn and his mates only spoke about these issues and I am totally unaware of Corbyn promoting violence or terrorism in any form. Blair was responsible for bombing civilians in Yugoslavia as well as the Iraq war. Thatcher and her mates supported Pohl Pot and Pinochet. The differences are enormous.

[elvoys]

Corbyn's no promoter of violence. You're mixing him up with Blair. What will it take to get you to realise that over a million Iraqis are dead and countless others had their lives destroyed because of strong and stable leadership. Corbyn and his mates only spoke about these issues and I am totally unaware of Corbyn promoting violence or terrorism in any form. Blair was responsible for bombing civilians in Yugoslavia as well as the Iraq war. Thatcher and her mates supported Pohl Pot and Pinochet. The differences are enormous.

Blairs botch was thinking u could introduce democracy to a nation without the half who had enjoyed a life of supremacy wishing to wipe out the half who would take it. but millions don't shed tears for Saddam, especially the Kurds.

 

Natos Serbian intervention was correct and halted a genocide of Kosovan Muslims but they never get the credit for that funnily enough.

 

Thinking of Iraq i forgot Comrade Corbyn victim blamed along with the reptile Galloway the day after 7/7. Last time I checked Dewsbury wasn't in Iraq or bombed at any time by UK/us.

 

The differences are huge. Jezbollah, McDonnell, Livingston et al explicitly side and condone the actions of criminal, brutal, terrorist thugs and have a long track record of doing so.

 

And almost forgetting , the shocking legacy of their hero Chavez has made them look even more stupid and dangerous.

[elvoys]

Oh and another - Corbyn explicitly backed the Sunni 'resistance' against US intervention in 2003. This was the forerunner of Al Qaeda and IS. Five years previously he had voted against govts move to list AQ as a terror org.

 

There is no number of hand knitted wooly jumpers that can disguise he's a wrongun.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

To cap it all their Manifesto has been leaked.

 

I wonder who would do such a thing.

 

And according to the leak, Labour plans to re-nationalise the Railways, Royal Mail & The Energy Sector.

Whilst that might not be such a bad thing and will appeal to many people, just where the money comes from to do it, is anybody's guess.

That ship sailed a long time ago I'm afraid, I don't even think the state owns some of the power stations anymore either, It'll cost Billions and Billions.

 

And on top of spending Billions on re-nationalising the above, they are also saying that they'll give the NHS an extra ?6 Billion (a year I'd presume).

Corbyn must have a forest of magic money trees hidden away somewhere.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

Phillip Hammond attended a rally at the start of the month addressing skin headed fascists under the Nazi banner and portraits of Hitler.

 

Oh wait, that was actually McDonnell under the hammer and sickle and Stalins mug. Prob being a bit harsh on Hitler tbh seeing as old Joe outdid his camp toll by X5.

 

Honestly, what will it take to get away from the harmless old garden Gnome schtick that folks send his way? Between him, McDonnell and Abbot they have attended Hezbollah marches, been sacked by Red Ken for being too left, called Hamas 'friends', openly supported IRA and said Labour members not doing so deserved to be knee capped, hosted Sinn Fein the week after near assasination of the PM and said Chairman Mao did 'more good than harm'.

 

An absolute moral disgrace that mob. Spare me the decent old values snash.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if some of this stuff is brought up about Corbyn's past in the coming weeks.

[Rudolf's Mate]

Corbyn's no promoter of violence. You're mixing him up with Blair. What will it take to get you to realise that over a million Iraqis are dead and countless others had their lives destroyed because of strong and stable leadership. Corbyn and his mates only spoke about these issues and I am totally unaware of Corbyn promoting violence or terrorism in any form. Blair was responsible for bombing civilians in Yugoslavia as well as the Iraq war. Thatcher and her mates supported Pohl Pot and Pinochet. The differences are enormous.

So why does Corbyn and some of his cronies criticise our troops whilst showing his support for terrorists?

 

As much as I don't agree or question our troops going into some countries or the reasons for doing so I have nothing but respect for those that put their life on the line for our country.

 

 

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[Maroon Sailor]

Well.said elvoys. Corbyn is a wrongun and not such the pacifist he makes himself out to be. There is a nasty undercurrent to him

[Boris]

Well.said elvoys. Corbyn is a wrongun and not such the pacifist he makes himself out to be. There is a nasty undercurrent to him

 

Not as nasty as the Tories, imo.

[Jamhammer]

This Labour government is like something out of The Thick of It and Corbyn is like political yoghurt. They are unelectable and, when the opposition is led by the Emperor from Star Wars that takes some ******* doing

[Boris]

This Labour government is like something out of The Thick of It and Corbyn is like political yoghurt. They are unelectable and, when the opposition is led by the Emperor from Star Wars that takes some ******* doing

 

This is what I don't get.  It's plain that the Tories are a bunch of evil ****ers, but still people won't vote Labour and will in turn vote Tory?

 

I don't get it.

[doctor jambo]

So you have diagnosed a congenital predisposition to conservatism, frugality, independence and hard working self reliance amongst Scots and suggest that these characteristics are at odds with "socialist virtue" 

 I'm not sure what socialist virtue is in your mind but I'm certain that Socialism includes those qualities you quoted as well as the best attributes of humanity. This contrasts significantly with the self interest and greed frequently espoused by you. Perhaps if you had to sell your skills on the open market you might find things less lucrative and value more the society you live in. You have a big salary because our society values the health of all it's citizens. That I believe is part of socialist virtue.

I have a reasonable salary because of years of training and very long hours....................................

In an open market my wages would be massively more than they currently are- in Australia they would double overnight, same Newzealand.

America and Canada the differential is even higher

My income is artificially supressed in the UK- demand is high and supply is really short.

and whilst I recognise your above socialist values - what Corbyn et al are espousing is not for the "workers" but quite the opposite.

I would be totally in favour of the living wage, and scrap all in work benefits completely.

If Corbyn thinks that a 5% hike in tax is a winner he's off his nut- it certainly may be for those who would like some more money for no extra effort- but it has been shown again and again that the higher the tax rates the lower the gross tax take is

[Craig_]

To cap it all their Manifesto has been leaked.

 

I wonder who would do such a thing.

 

Putin?!

[Jambo-Jimbo]

This is what I don't get.  It's plain that the Tories are a bunch of evil ****ers, but still people won't vote Labour and will in turn vote Tory?

 

I don't get it.

 

The lesser of two evils Boris, and that's saying something as everybody knows the Tories are a bunch of nasty evil barstewards.

 

We all laughed at the Americans having a choice between Trump or Clinton, well we've now got a choice between May or Corbyn, neither of whom fill me with much enthusiasm.

 

For me Corbyn's message, his whole rhetoric is like something out of the 70's, Britain and the World have moved on from those days, the people whom that message would have resonated with back in the 70's are now in many cases the very same middle/higher earners that Corbyn wants to tax to the hilt.  Times have changed, Corbyn hasn't IMO.

[Malcolm Tucker]

The lesser of two evils Boris, and that's saying something as everybody knows the Tories are a bunch of nasty evil barstewards.

 

We all laughed at the Americans having a choice between Trump or Clinton, well we've now got a choice between May or Corbyn, neither of whom fill me with much enthusiasm.

 

For me Corbyn's message, his whole rhetoric is like something out of the 70's, Britain and the World have moved on from those days, the people whom that message would have resonated with back in the 70's are now in many cases the very same middle/higher earners that Corbyn wants to tax to the hilt. Times have changed, Corbyn hasn't IMO.

How anyone, literally anyone can say that Theresa May is a lesser evil than Jeremy Corbyn is absolutely mind-boggling. I just don't get it. This Tory government is going to drive an even bigger wedge between the rich and poor, but it seems a lot of the poor haven't woken up and realised that yet.

 

I'm getting out of the UK pronto tbh, it's no for me anymore.

[doctor jambo]

I'm presuming the leaked manifesto is a joke, at least I hope its a joke.

Hike in Income tax

Hike in inheritance tax and business rates

Borrow ?250 billion for infrastructure

Renationalise this and that

No immigration quotas

Collective bargaining over pay

Guys clearly feckin mad

[Maroon Sailor]

I'm presuming the leaked manifesto is a joke, at least I hope its a joke.

Hike in Income tax

Hike in inheritance tax and business rates

Borrow ?250 billion for infrastructure

Renationalise this and that

No immigration quotas

Collective bargaining over pay

Guys clearly feckin mad

Strong and Stable bananas

[Rudolf's Mate]

Corbyn is a *****. It really is as simple as that.

 

 

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[Malcolm Tucker]

Corbyn is a *****. It really is as simple as that.

 

 

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Theresa May is a ****ing *****. Also quite simple.

[Rudolf's Mate]

Theresa May is a ******* *****. Also quite simple.

[enter most politicians name here] are the ***** of all *****. Couldn't get more simpler.

 

 

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[KineticBeat]

How anyone, literally anyone can say that Theresa May is a lesser evil than Jeremy Corbyn is absolutely mind-boggling. I just don't get it. This Tory government is going to drive an even bigger wedge between the rich and poor, but it seems a lot of the poor haven't woken up and realised that yet.

 

I'm getting out of the UK pronto tbh, it's no for me anymore.

 

You've echoed my feeling entirely here. 

 

I'm lucky where my line of work would make moving abroad very possible and I'm leaning more towards it daily at the moment.

[Rudolf's Mate]

You've echoed my feeling entirely here.

 

I'm lucky where my line of work would make moving abroad very possible and I'm leaning more towards it daily at the moment.

So you're leaning towards moving abroad if May and her party get elected? Bit late are you no [emoji3]

 

 

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[KineticBeat]

So you're leaning towards moving abroad if May and her party get elected? Bit late are you no [emoji3]

 

 

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Never said that did I? Just said I was leaning more towards it daily.

[Rudolf's Mate]

Never said that did I? Just said I was leaning more towards it daily.

No worries.

 

 

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[Jamhammer]

This is what I don't get. It's plain that the Tories are a bunch of evil ****ers, but still people won't vote Labour and will in turn vote Tory?

 

I don't get it.

Oh I will never vote Tory. My grandad will rise from the dead and kill me. But neither will I vote for a party with Dianne ****in Abbot as Home Secretary.

 

 

 

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[aussieh]

Pretty good manifesto. What's the Tories offering? Brexit? Strong and Stable? Fascism?

[coconut doug]

I have a reasonable salary because of years of training and very long hours....................................

In an open market my wages would be massively more than they currently are- in Australia they would double overnight, same Newzealand.

America and Canada the differential is even higher

My income is artificially supressed in the UK- demand is high and supply is really short.

and whilst I recognise your above socialist values - what Corbyn et al are espousing is not for the "workers" but quite the opposite.

I would be totally in favour of the living wage, and scrap all in work benefits completely.

If Corbyn thinks that a 5% hike in tax is a winner he's off his nut- it certainly may be for those who would like some more money for no extra effort- but it has been shown again and again that the higher the tax rates the lower the gross tax take is

I don't deny the skills and training of doctors and expect them to have a decent salary. Nevertheless I cannot understand how you expect so much and are willing to contribute so little through tax.

 

In an open market most doctors would struggle as they did in this country before the NHS. You can get a bigger salary abroad perhaps but you will have to be good to get the best jobs. You could of course choose to work in the private sector in the U.K. A bit risky though, probably much better to have the security and lower expectations of the NHS. There is a surfeit of doctors and there are plane loads only too willing to come here from the sub continent, to work in the NHS.

 

I don't understand what you mean by demand is high and supply short and how this suppresses your income. The last Labour government apparently threw huge amounts of money at GPs and now their average salary is well over six figures. As private businesses you can offset everything against tax anyway and you are constantly courted by drug companies as well as having ample opportunity for private work using NHS staff and facilities.

 

I don't know what you mean either about Corbyn not being for the workers. Where did the 5% increase in income tax come from? I thought nobody under ?80,000 a year was going to pay more tax.

 

Where has it been shown again and again that higher tax rates lead to less revenue, by that logic we should reduce the rate to 0% and the money will fly in. There is of course a sweet spot where revenues are maximised. We have some way to go before we reach that for most but if some think it's already here they are entitled to review their options but most of us live in a world where six figure salaries are not realistic.

[Rudy T]

Pretty good manifesto. What's the Tories offering? Brexit? Strong and Stable? Fascism?

Looks more like a wish list to me than a deliverable manifesto.

[JamboX2]

Theresa May is absolutely dreadful as a Prime Minister.

 

Corbyn is a poor leader for Labour at this time (or any). Good manifesto though.

 

Still rather have PM Corbyn than PM May.

[Dawnrazor]

Could've been written in 1976.

[aussieh]

Theresa May is absolutely dreadful as a Prime Minister.

 

Corbyn is a poor leader for Labour at this time (or any). Good manifesto though.

 

Still rather have PM Corbyn than PM May.

Me too. Indyref2 was voted through holyrood, so I'm seriously considering labour. One big issue, though. I can't vote for Slab.

[aussieh]

Could've been written in 1976.

When was the Tory manifesto written, 1933?

[Dawnrazor]

When was the Tory manifesto written, 1933?

Naw, but Labours is a hark back to darker times, I don't fancy a 3 day week like my dad.