Making a Murderer (contains spoilers)

[chester copperpot]

Am I the only one who finds Teresa's brother to be a smug, deluded piece of s##t as well?

 

 

Yeah the fact he was convinced that Avery and Dassey were guilty without even hearing the evidence convinced me that this boy is not all it makes out to be. Guaranteed he was being guided by Kratz as to what he was saying to the press every day.

 

There's so much holes in this case that it actually makes me angry at the injustice and that poor wee laddie in jail being set up by the people trusted to help him.

[gashauskis9]

Yeah the fact he was convinced that Avery and Dassey were guilty without even hearing the evidence convinced me that this boy is not all it makes out to be. Guaranteed he was being guided by Kratz as to what he was saying to the press every day.

 

There's so much holes in this case that it actually makes me angry at the injustice and that poor wee laddie in jail being set up by the people trusted to help him.

Exactly, yet he completely ignored the fact that her ex-boyfriend's alibi was as woolly as it gets (he couldn't even remember what time of day he last saw her!).

[redm]

Am I the only one who finds Teresa's brother to be a smug, deluded piece of s##t as well?

No. He was way too keen to speak to the media for my liking, never mind his point blank refusal to acknowledge the flaws in the prosecution case against Avery/Dassey. Mind you, maybe it's just how people are if you lose someone in circumstances like that...he'll have been desperate to find closure and grieve. There was definitely something really off about him and that Hillegas ex of hers. Accessing her voicemail and stuff. Someone deleted messages and they didn't really ever explore that issue when they really should have done given the witness reports about how someone was harassing her by phone in weeks before her death.

 

Her brother works for Green Bay Packers by the way. Not really relevant but it's interesting.

 

http://www.packers.com/team/staff/Mike-Halbach/bc32b029-52e7-4e07-b172-f9580ded39f3

[Daydream Believer]

Watched it all. Avery is probably guilty. Although you could never really convict him on evidence. What it showed me was that the American justice system is designed to get a conviction at all costs.

 

 

 

Similar arguments could be made against the defense (that they wan't a non guilty regardless of innocence).

 

They thought that they had the smoking gun when they found the tampered blood vial (as did I) but when the police went to the FBI for the test, the defense lawyers were immediately against it. They said that they didn't trust the FBI which seems a stretch to me; if they were convinced of his innocence then I don't know why they wouldn't want the test. Then their only counter to a quite reasonable FBI agent was that he only tested 3 swabs not 6.

 

For that matter I think it was quite clear why the DNA specialist allowed the test, given that the only contamination was that of the person making the test.

 

The defense would quite happily have had the case thrown out on a procedural issue if they could. 

[redm]

Similar arguments could be made against the defense (that they wan't a non guilty regardless of innocence).

 

They thought that they had the smoking gun when they found the tampered blood vial (as did I) but when the police went to the FBI for the test, the defense lawyers were immediately against it. They said that they didn't trust the FBI which seems a stretch to me; if they were convinced of his innocence then I don't know why they wouldn't want the test. Then their only counter to a quite reasonable FBI agent was that he only tested 3 swabs not 6.

 

For that matter I think it was quite clear why the DNA specialist allowed the test, given that the only contamination was that of the person making the test.

 

The defense would quite happily have had the case thrown out on a procedural issue if they could.

Re: the blood tests, that's not quite the case as I understand it... Apparently the tests were not conclusive, that's the problem. The woman who conducted the tests tried to claim they were conclusive then described her methodology and turns out they aren't conclusive at all. In short, the test didn't detect EDTA but that doesn't mean it isn't there. Plus they introduced this as evidence mid-way through the trial so the defence didn't get a chance to conduct their own tests or examine the testing methodology in real detail.

 

They never did explain how the FBI managed to complete tests which usually take months in just a few weeks either.

[Daydream Believer]

Re: the blood tests, that's not quite the case as I understand it... Apparently the tests were not conclusive, that's the problem. The woman who conducted the tests tried to claim they were conclusive then described her methodology and turns out they aren't conclusive at all. In short, the test didn't detect EDTA but that doesn't mean it isn't there. Plus they introduced this as evidence mid-way through the trial so the defence didn't get a chance to conduct their own tests or examine the testing methodology in real detail.

 

They never did explain how the FBI managed to complete tests which usually take months in just a few weeks either.

 

Fair points, ultimately the jury saw a lot more than any of us did and expert witness testimony probably comes down to which seems most credible.

 

Based on the documentary I don't feel that there's enough evidence to convict (particularly the young lad) but I'm wondering if that would be true of any trial that was condensed to a few hours by filmakers who have motive to side with the defense.

 

I get the feeling that the reaction to this show may end up being more interesting than the show itself.

 

 

(Incidentally I'm feeling a bit nervous about the reaction to the dead girls brother and ex. As far as we know they've done nothing wrong and internet reaction has a way of affecting peoples real lives these days)

[Rudolf's Mate]

Similar arguments could be made against the defense (that they wan't a non guilty regardless of innocence).

 

They thought that they had the smoking gun when they found the tampered blood vial (as did I) but when the police went to the FBI for the test, the defense lawyers were immediately against it. They said that they didn't trust the FBI which seems a stretch to me; if they were convinced of his innocence then I don't know why they wouldn't want the test. Then their only counter to a quite reasonable FBI agent was that he only tested 3 swabs not 6.

 

For that matter I think it was quite clear why the DNA specialist allowed the test, given that the only contamination was that of the person making the test.

 

The defense would quite happily have had the case thrown out on a procedural issue if they could.

You can't really make similar arguments against the defence as it guilty beyond reasonable doubt. A jury which concludes the accused is probably guilty has to acquit.

 

At the very least there was huge, huge doubt that Avery was guilty.

 

The defence didn't want the test to be included because it was fact that it was not reliable. They were worried that unreliable evidence could essentially secure a conviction.

 

They pressed the FBI guy on the swabs because he made a declaration that he was absolutely certain there was no EDTA present period. Even when it was put to him that he only tested 3 swabs and to make such a statement was assumption he stuck by his guns and said within a reasonable degree of scientific certainty. There's no science involved and it's pure guessing!

 

His testimony was blown out the water and it actually made it look like the FBI were hell bent on helping them convict Avery. The fact the FBI abandoned those tests 10+ years earlier because they were unreliable shows it shouldn't have been included.

 

The amount of evidence that was shown to be incorrect yet the judge allowed various stuff to be included plus didn't instruct the jury to ignore.

 

At the very least it should have been a mistrial but on what we've seen he should have been acquitted.

 

We keep hearing there's other damning evidence re Avery however if there is/was then you'd have expected it to have been heard through official channels rather than rumours.

 

That policeman couldn't give an explanation for calling in her registration 2 days before she's been reported missing All he said was something along the lines of I shouldn't have been looking at her plate and I wasn't!

[Koolkeith]

The judge's statement when he sentenced Avery was ridiculous. Basically saying his crimes are getting worse as he gets older and is a real danger to society. I think he's forgetting the he didn't actually commit the crime he was jailed for the first time.

Edited January 9, 2016 by Koolkeith

[Peebo]

The judge's statement when he sentenced Avery was ridiculous. Basically saying his crimes are getting worse as he gets older and is a real danger to society. I think he's forgetting the he didn't actually commit the crime he was jailed for the first time.

True, but he does have other convictions.

[redm]

True, but he does have other convictions.

Difficult to really use a claim of escalating violence when the last time he committed any sort of crime may well have been over 30 years ago. Or it's a stretch anyway.

[Peebo]

Difficult to really use a claim of escalating violence when the last time he committed any sort of crime may well have been over 30 years ago. Or it's a stretch anyway.

A stretch, yes. But not incorrect (based on standing convictions).

[redm]

A stretch, yes. But not incorrect (based on standing convictions).

True but I think the issue is that a rap sheet for a 53 year old with a 30 year gap in it wouldn't normally be used like this, so his comments are a bit weird. Escalation suggests a steady regular increase. It's just a very odd approach from judge in a long sequence of odd approaches from authority figures. It all adds up.

[Peebo]

True but I think the issue is that a rap sheet for a 53 year old with a 30 year gap in it wouldn't normally be used like this, so his comments are a bit weird. Escalation suggests a steady regular increase. It's just a very odd approach from judge in a long sequence of odd approaches from authority figures. It all adds up.

Fair dues. I am certainly not arguing against the judge being a total *****.

 

Worth noting that the thirty years (although more like 20, no?) you talk about was punctuated by a long time in prison for the BS rape conviction. His other standing convictions happened a couple of years before he went in, and this murder conviction a couple of years after he came out. Being in prison much of the meantime presumably just paused the escalation (in the judge's mind).

Edited January 10, 2016 by Peebo

[lou]

Wow,finished today and I am a mixture of drained and sad,the brendan decision is beyond belief,surely not a retrial but a completely new investigation required

[Sooperstar]

Felt so sorry for the lad Brandon. He was way out of his depth and did not understand the seriousness of the situation. He just wanted out of there so he could go and hand in his school project FFS. Then his main concern was missing Wrestlemania. His confession was just a series of guesses from him at what he thought the interrogators wanted to hear before they would let him go on his way. Shan.

[JamboHeriot]

http://www.nbcchicago.com/entertainment/entertainment-news/making-a-murderer-juror-says-avery-not-guilty-364234661.html?_osource=SocialFlowFB_CHBrand

 

Some more interesting fallout.

[Hendricks]

Absolutely compulsive viewing. I don't think I've ever been glued to something on TV out with a sporting event like that ever before. Was like an amazing book it was impossible to put down or switch off from. Watching it the emotions were all over the place; from utter astonishment at what happened in the first case, to anger and outrage at the clear mishandling at very best of the 2nd case to my own feeling that at least 2 of the Police were 100% corrupt, to the sadness at how coerced the clearly limited Brendan was, to the disbelief at the guilty verdicts given the massive holes in so much of the 'evidence'. Just an amazing real life story.

 

In no particular order I think there are a whole host of things that raise reasonable doubt in the cases either at the time or in retrospect.

1)Why leave a car right next to the crusher with your blood in it when you have a perfectly good crusher.
2)Why meticulously clean the trailer/garage but not clean the car you allegedly transported her in. Does anyone believe Steven Avery was capable of cleaning a crime scene.
3)Why leave the burned bones in clear view right next to your house.
4)How is none of Brendan's DNA anywhere in the crime scene.
5)How does Manitoc County find all the evidence when they were explicity told by the "authorities" to step aside.
6)What about the deleted voicemails. 
7)Why were none of the people who were also possible suspects including the other Darrey brother, Brenden's stepdad, the brother, the ex-boyfrieind and the roommate never investigated.
8)Why were there two conflicting theories of what happened used to convict them both if they actually had an airtight case.
9)The convenience of this case ending the SA lawsuit and saving the county.
10)The tampered with blood from the previous case.
11)The key magically appearing after many many searches.
12)How does a 7-3-2 notguilty/guilty/unsure turn into a unanimous decision. That from my understanding almost never happens.
13)The horrific way that Brenden's investigation was handled from both the original defense attorney, and the investigators.
14)There was no motive presented.
15)Colburn knowing the make and model of the car before she was reported missing.
16)The phone records of Brenden and Steve.
17)The bias of the judges.
18)Blood in the car but no fingerprints.
19)The people closest to her did not report her missing for 4 days. If my roommate doesn't show up for like a day or two and doesn't answer phone/text I probably don't wait 4 days to do anything.
20)All of the lying and inconsistencies on the stand by Lenk and Colburn.
21)The fact the Manitoc Co. inbreds who obviously don't like the Averys got to be the jury
22)The fact two people on the jury had direct relations to the Manitoc Co. sheriff's department. 

 

Whilst it is obvious that Avery was no saint the prosecutions 'case' was not anywhere close to passing the reasonable doubt standard. It just made no sense that it was him. As for Brendan's case is I think the odds of him doing it or having anything to do with it being less than 5%. He is very clearly close to being mentally retarded, was scared and completely susceptible to the people around him influencing him. Telling him that he would be fine if he said what they wanted to was what made him say it, not because it was the truth. The whole thing stunk and the characters in the prosecution and within the Manitoc authorities came across throughout as being arrogant and smug and in many instances as downright liars. There were very few occasions I did not believe Avery where as continually you felt the prosecution and their witnesses were lying. An astonishing must watch real life documentary from start to finish.

Edited January 11, 2016 by Hendricks

[Maiden Gorgie]

Wow, just finished watching this last night. 

 

Brendan's first attorney (Kachinsky?) was enjoying the limelight far too much. Obviously a relatively small time lawyer and thought this was his time. The way he laughed and joked his way through the case then the motion later on was stomach-churning. He was supposed to be trying to help a 16 year old backward kid FFS, an absolute cretin.

 

The victim's brother was weird, didn't take to him at all. Something fishy there IMO.

 

Avery was obviously a bit of a hellraiser in his youth and those 18 years in the clink for something he didn't do must have messed him up more. Did he do it? Who knows but certainly not in the way the prosecution say he did.

 

As for Brendan - couldn't stop thinking about him after it had finished, to think he is 28 now is horrendous. All that wasted time for something he was effectively bullied into admitting he did. 

 

Who knows this may rear it's ugly head again in the future. Really hope so, for Brendan especially.

 

One of the most dramatic and thought-provoking things I have seen, ever.

[Hendricks]

One thing I forgot to mention in my post was something I felt throughout - Avery's defence attorneys were absolutely superb. Total stars and its unsurprising to read they have garnered a lot of praise on the back of it. Just amazing minds and a class above anything representing the state on the prosecution. 

[Maiden Gorgie]

One thing I forgot to mention in my post was something I felt throughout - Avery's defence attorneys were absolutely superb. Total stars and its unsurprising to read they have garnered a lot of praise on the back of it. Just amazing minds and a class above anything representing the state on the prosecution. 

 

This. They were brilliant, and they obviously cared. The shorter of the two was almost greetin in that last scene where they were discussing what could happen next. They certainly weren't in it for the dough.

Edited January 11, 2016 by Maiden Gorgie

[Hendricks]

[Maiden Gorgie]

 

 

 

 

I know, chuffing horrendous stuff. 

 

Thing is who knows how far up the corruption goes. The Supreme Court threw out any appeal out too.

 

There is every chance these guys will never get a fair trial, it would be explosive stuff to say the least and many heads would roll. Does the US legal system want that? Does it ****.

Edited January 11, 2016 by Maiden Gorgie

[151]

Oh yeah, and another thing.

 

How come Steven Avery got done with the murderer but not the mutilation, and Brendan ended up with the mutilation?

 

What a load of utter nonsense. Theres more truth in some of the stuff on Hibs.net than what there was in the courtroom for the prosecution.

[Hendricks]

Interesting interview with Dean Strang. Comes across very well again. Along with many issues the Toyota key appearing on the SEVENTH search clearly troubles him very badly to this day.

 

http://www.wkow.com/story/30834876/2015/12/27/attorney-dean-strang-discusses-stevern-avery-case-on-capitol-city-sunday

Edited January 11, 2016 by Hendricks

[Hendricks]

Another troubling thing was the discovery of the car. The two women that found the Rav4 on the Avery property went almost directly to it after being given a camera and being directed to search by two people who I believe should have been potential persons of interest (the brother and the ex boyfriend). That property is absolutely massive yet they found it within half an hour. The brother and ex boyfriend were also involved in the bizarre password hacking to get both phone records and listen to voice messages, some of which were then deleted. The brother also talks about grieving and moving on 2 days after she went missing. Most of the time, family will continue talking about their loved one in the present tense for a long period after the person went missing. The only reason you'd talk about her in the past tense is if you somehow know she's dead, or you're just very very pessimistic. For me he behaved oddly throughout.

Edited January 11, 2016 by Hendricks

[Maiden Gorgie]

Interesting interview with Dean Strang. Comes across very well again. Along with many issues the Toyota key appearing on the SEVENTH search clearly troubles him very badly to this day.

 

http://www.wkow.com/story/30834876/2015/12/27/attorney-dean-strang-discusses-stevern-avery-case-on-capitol-city-sunday

 

Clearly an extremely intelligent guy. He answered those questions brilliantly, on a live TV show. Talk about thinking on your feet.

 

His demeanour throughout showed that as you say, the whole thing still doesn't sit right with him. 

[lou]

I have read a lot of articles since I finishes, I am still 50/50 on Averys guilt,but there was never enough to convict,as for Brendan,an astonishing verdict with no witnesses or evidence

[Daydream Believer]

Netflix seem to be doing good documentaries right now.

 

Winter on Fire IMO is a better documentary than Making a Murderer ( though they are both very good)

[Hendricks]

• 

Edited January 11, 2016 by Hendricks

[Hendricks]

So many things keep coming back into my head - what about the old boy that did the facial composite of the "suspect" which was basically Avery's mugshot and then had his sketch framed and put up in his office. Just utterly bizarre.

 

Some alternative theories:

 

http://fusion.net/story/249427/netflix-making-a-murderer-what-happened-theories/

Edited January 12, 2016 by Hendricks

[chester copperpot]

Oh yeah, and another thing.

 

How come Steven Avery got done with the murderer but not the mutilation, and Brendan ended up with the mutilation?

 

What a load of utter nonsense. Theres more truth in some of the stuff on Hibs.net than what there was in the courtroom for the prosecution.

 

 

This has been bugging me too since watching it. If anything surely it would be Avery that had cut up the body.

 

The evidence against him is sketchy at the very best, but how they can hand on heart say he is 100% guilty with all the evidence and police corruption in this case beggars belief.

 

A jury has to be 100% beyond doubt convinced that the person is guilty, however I fail to see how someone can do that with all the evidence presented.

[Hendricks]

 That ******* lawyer of his Kachinsky and the evil investigator guy should be up on criminal charges themselves for what they did to this young guy. So wrong. So so wrong.

 

He simply doesn't give a s**t. Even now. Barely able to answer anything and excuses galore.

 

Edited January 12, 2016 by Hendricks

[chester copperpot]

He simply doesn't give a s**t. Even now. Barely able to answer anything and excuses galore.

 

 

 

I've never heard a lawyer stutter and back track as much as in that interview. The boys a ******* and should be protecting that poor laddie!

[GlasgoJambo]

The evidence in this case does nothing to make Steven Avery any more culpable of the murder than anyone else - in fact the contradictions and obvious tampering of evidence actually make him less of a suspect as they suggest a concerted effort to make him look guilty.

The prosecution presented evidence that in the bulk merely proved Teresa was at the Avery car lot - which no one disputes. The rest of the evidence proved more that something weird was going on than Steve Avery was guilty. However after Kratz's press conference where he luridly presents the gruesome details of her death as fact to a TV audience including potential jurors, months before trial (and that Dateline reporter admits ?Murder is hot, that?s what everyone wants...") Steve Avery kicks off the trial as already guilty.

But as the evidence is so flimsy (and systematically destroyed by the defence) you realise it doesn't come down to the validity of the evidence - it comes down to a predisposition of Steven Avery's character (the rapist, mutilating, controlling murderer according to the District Attorney) and whether you can really believe that the Polis and authorities are corrupt and I think for a lot of people that's a really scary (and unAmerican) thing to believe - as shown by the brother's unfettered belief in the integrity of the authorities (which by the way is weird as hell as he's desperate to believe Brendan's most horrific version of events with regards how his sister died).

Despite being shown Lenk was contradicting himself about the time he was at the car lot and therefore lying under oath - this on top of the fact he wasn't meant to be there anyway as the public are repeatedly told there is no involvement by Mantowic County - and this is a guy who has been deposed, the brother and ultimately a unanimous jury believed the prosecution's version of events. Despite Officer Colburn's weird fumbling of information which would have cleared Steve Avery in the rape case and his later calling in of Teresa's registration plate before the car is found, and also having been deposed, the brother, and ultimately the jury believed the prosecution's version of events! The key - found only after a number of searches have turned nothing up, found in a really obvious place, found by Lenk who wasn't meant to be there, assisted by Colburn's who wasn't meant to be there, found to have ONLY Steven Avery's DNA on it not even the owners DNA.

I'm surprised that their (Mantowic Countys) presence in a Police investigation they weren't meant to be involved in wasn't enough to make the jury completely sceptical of the entire investigation. I'm surprised that the Judge didn't see it as grounds for dismissing the trial. I'm surprised the Supreme Court don't see this as a deeply flawed and suspicious case. I'm amazed that when confronted by the Chicago firm's annihilation of the attorney in the Dassey trial, his failure to defend him and the fact that he and the investigator were working to achieve a result which would assist the prosecution in another case, no retrial was granted. The Chicago folk were almost smiling every time they spoke as if they were flabbergasted at the obvious miscarriages of justice littering the case. The Wisconsin justice system is protecting the Wisconsin justice system as opposed to its people. Thanks be they don't have the death penalty.

 

The whole thing's ****ed - no motive, no previous, no concrete evidence - but boy it's made compelling viewing. Perhaps the reporter from Dateline speaks for all of us!

[GlasgoJambo]

So many things keep coming back into my head - what about the old boy that did the facial composite of the "suspect" which was basically Avery's mugshot and then had his sketch framed and put up in his office. Just utterly bizarre.

 

Some alternative theories:

 

http://fusion.net/story/249427/netflix-making-a-murderer-what-happened-theories/

what about when he kind of shrugged off the suggestion that Avery was innocent of the crime he was wrongly imprisoned for. Despite Avery being cleared (by DNA) and someone else being guilty he still suggested Avery was probably guilty, like it came down to opinion not fact.

[redm]

He simply doesn't give a s**t. Even now. Barely able to answer anything and excuses galore.

 

That makes me so angry. The fact he even agreed to do this interview knowing perfectly well that he doesn't have the answers and would sound like a dick shows just how little of a shit he gives. Clearly loves the attention though, what a complete desperado.

[Malcolm Tucker]

I'll put up a full review later, but as I'm in work just now and only have a few minutes I'll just say this.

 

I think Scott Tadych and Bobby Dassey did it.

[jackal]

Dont think I have watched anything and said WTF so many times.

 

Imagine being convicted on the evidence given its unthinkable. I had jury duty many years ago involving a child abuse case within a family. Almost everyone on the jury reckoned they had done it but the evidence was so poor Im surprised it was in court. It was one family members word against the other and felt more like retribution for something else rather than a claim of abuse.

 

Any way without knowing what was cut from the Netflix version no sane person would have convicted either men on the evidence given considering the way it was gathered or miraculously found.

 

A few things stuck out for me,

 

Ask a women to find a particular type of car in a car park you would be lucky but ask her to find it in a salvage yard and she finds it in 20minutes after checking maybe 50 cars or less.

 

They had a car crusher yards from where the car was found

 

Sure I heard they had an incinerator on site also so why not burn the body there rather than at your back door.

 

Not one spot of her DNA anywhere, no blood no sweat no semen from either men.

 

No one else questioned when most likely the killer is someone the person knows

 

people sense of time in that area !!!!! they dont even know if its light or dark when they are visiting people.

 

The brother and the ex boyfriend questioned in the same room at the same time.

 

The Brother with no emotion what so ever until the speech for sentencing when he could hardly hold back the tears.

 

The judges refusal of almost anything to benefit the defence and the refusal for removing that smarmy little prick lawyer from Brendans defence.

 

Kratz (the pieman) instant dislike for him and his voice arrgghhh.

 

Lenk and the other tamperers, how many other times have they done this or were the trying to make sure there was no way out this time and fecked up big time in trying to do so.

 

So many things wrong with that trial and trying not to repeat what we all are saying its hard not to feel sad that this type of thing happens and by the people you are meant to have most respect for.

 

If you ever get accused of a crime in the state make sure you GTFO before they take you to trial.

[marcus]

One of the filmmakers was asked if there had been any comeuppance for the officials involved.....nope, they were promoted and/or given awards.

 

The amount of times during the case where you thought it couldn't get any more ****ed up...then along came the next mental thing.

 

I think the worst thing is the absolute refusal/failure from the Supreme court (amongst others) to bring a re-trial.

 

Dean Strang said it at some part in the series....there's an ego that goes along with the whole justice system that refuses to believe it is ever wrong. No-one is ever willing to say "yup, I got it wrong, let's learn from this and set it right".

[Dia Liom]

so glad someone else said it earlier in the thread, anytime Kratz was onscreen I couldn't stop chanting 'Pieman gtf pieman pieman..'

[Sooperstar]

I'll put up a full review later, but as I'm in work just now and only have a few minutes I'll just say this.

 

I think Scott Tadych and Bobby Dassey did it.

That's where I am. They both appear to have lied, implicating their own family members in the process, and I can't think of any reason for doing that other than having something to hide themselves.

 

They were each others only alibis.

 

It would make sense in terms of where it appears the actual burn location of the body was.

 

They would know that suspicion would immediately fall on Avery.

 

They didn't seem to be interested in arguing the car for the innocence of Avery or Brendan.

 

They both seem like arseholes.

[Carl Fredrickson]

so glad someone else said it earlier in the thread, anytime Kratz was onscreen I couldn't stop chanting 'Pieman gtf pieman pieman..'

 

As if you couldnt hate Kratz enough......

[Angry Haggis]

And the stuff coming out about Kratz at the end. Seedy pest.

[Hendricks]

And the stuff coming out about Kratz at the end. Seedy pest.

 

His firms Yelp page......http://www.yelp.com/biz/kratz-law-firm-west-bend

[gashauskis9]

I'll put up a full review later, but as I'm in work just now and only have a few minutes I'll just say this.

 

I think Scott Tadych and Bobby Dassey did it.

I agree.

[chester copperpot]

His firms Yelp page......http://www.yelp.com/biz/kratz-law-firm-west-bend

 

 

How the feck did you find that.

 

I just spent a half hour reading through that

[Gershwin]

I'll put up a full review later, but as I'm in work just now and only have a few minutes I'll just say this.

 

I think Scott Tadych and Bobby Dassey did it.

I certainly think they should have been suspects and at least investigated.

[chuck berrys hairline]

On episode seven tonight but thought something was rather fishy about the ex and the room mate from the search interview in episode two. The big fella was chalk white shitting bricks. Then to find out later they hacked into the voice mail accounts by pure guesswork?!?

 

Thinking they're working alongside the police who I don't need to comment on which hasn't already been covered.

 

Poor Brendan he was definitely duped there's no doubt about it. But it was a very nieve thing to do to cooperate and then not to allow him a lawyer present.

 

The other Dassey (cousin) and his alibi is something sketchy aswell.

[CollyWolly]

I feel a wee bit sorry for those visiting this thread who previously didn't know the outcome and have read it on here. It totally takes away from what a dramatic documentary this is. I was gobsmacked at the verdicts as I wasn't aware of the outcomes until I saw them live as it were.

 

Perhaps the mods could add - "Contains Spoilers" to the thread title or is it too late for that now ?

Edited January 13, 2016 by CollyWolly

[vegas-voss]

I feel a wee bit sorry for those visiting this thread who previously didn't know the outcome and have read it on here. It totally takes away from what a dramatic documentary this is. I was gobsmacked at the verdicts as I wasn't aware of the outcomes until I saw them live as it were.

 

Perhaps the mods could add - "Contains Spoilers" to the thread title or is it too late for that now ?

I know not everbody does but i just stayed well away from the thread until I finished watching it.