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Maroon Sailor

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Maiden Gorgie

Crime rates in Edinburgh now amongst the highest in the country, while detection rates are the lowest. Feckin marvellous.

 

Quite a damning stat that. Bring back L&B. Police Scotland just isn't working.

 

Get Rebus out of retirement too.

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siegementality

I wonder if we were ever the highest under Lothian and Borders

I can assure you we weren't.

 

The quicker House - and with any luck his special mate Mawson - feck off the better.

 

House has run Edinburgh's policing into the ground. If he had an ounce of humility he should be fecking ashamed of himself.

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Maroon Sailor

Why all of a sudden has Edinburgh been faced with particular challenges for policing ? Has this not always been the case when it was under Lothian and Borders but with better results ?

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-34581771

 

 

Crime rates in Edinburgh are the highest in Scotland according to a new report by the police watchdog.

 

HM Inspectorate of Constabulary found the capital to have the lowest rates of detection of the Scottish Divisions.

 

The report by HMICS, which scrutinises policing, is part of an ongoing process to review local services in the aftermath of the single police force.

 

It found Edinburgh had the most crimes per 10,000 of the population, with the lowest detection rates.

 

In particular housebreaking was an issue with last year seeing an increase of 20.8% in reports made.

 

Another finding was that confidence and satisfaction levels in policing in the capital were declining and below the national average.

 

Specialist resources

 

The report said Edinburgh faces particular challenges with policing, with 55 officers a day are being drawn from local duties to provide temporary cover for a range of additional demands such as pre-planned events.

 

It called for a review of the balance between local policing and specialist resources.

 

Derek Penman, HM Inspector of Constabulary, said: "We have taken the view that many of the issues affecting Edinburgh division have arisen because of the specific challenges that come with being the capital city.

 

"The single force has provided greater access to specialist support and has provided additional officers to assist in meeting these challenges.

 

"We have seen a reduction in violent crime of over 18% against the five year average with robberies alone down over 28%

Ch Supt Mark Williams, Police Scotland

 

"However I believe there is now a need for Police Scotland to review the balance between local policing and specialist resources to ensure there are sufficient officers within response and community policing roles across the division."

 

Mr Penman said the positive trends across Scotland of reducing crime levels and improved detection rates were "not mirrored in Edinburgh".

 

"However these challenges around performance existed before the creation of Police Scotland; and the reasons for them are complex and examined in our report," he added.

 

Ch Supt Mark Williams, of Police Scotland's Edinburgh division, said: "We've already made real advances to address issues such as housebreaking and, since our specific operation to tackle the issue launched early in 2015, we have halved the number of break-ins per month and doubled our detection rates.

 

"We have also seen a reduction in violent crime of over 18% against the five year average with robberies alone down over 28%.

 

"Theft is a real focus for local policing teams and overall it has reduced by 12% against a five year average with motor vehicle thefts down over 26% in the last year alone."

 

He added: "We are not complacent and will continue to focus on reducing antisocial behaviour and violence fuelled by alcohol in the city."

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  • In particular housebreaking was an issue with last year seeing an increase of 20.8% in reports made.

     

     

One of the first things House did under Police Scotland was to disband the very successful House Breaking Teams in Edinburgh.  These guys proactively went after the housebreakers and had an excellent dectection rate.  I heard housebreakers who were being released from prison were met at the gate and warned they were being monitored. Intelligence was shared between teams across the city and out in the Lothians.

 

Because HBs were not a Strathclyde priority, then they were not a Police Scotland priority.  So the whole of Scotland gets, stop & search for knives and street drinking, when they are not problem areas.  Once size fits all.

 

House, Mawson, Fitzpatrick the lot of them need the boot.

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Maroon Sailor

So positive trends across Police Scotland in reducing crime rates and improved detection rates are not mirrored in Edinburgh ?

 

Makes me think we should be having our own say in how we police the capital. If it wasn't broken why fix it ?

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So positive trends across Police Scotland in reducing crime rates and improved detection rates are not mirrored in Edinburgh ?

 

Makes me think we should be having our own say in how we police the capital. If it wasn't broken why fix it ?

 

Quite.

 

No reason you cant have one force, Police Scotland, with locally devolved management and strategy.

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Quite.

 

No reason you cant have one force, Police Scotland, with locally devolved management and strategy.

That's exactly what they do have. Not autonomous enough and restricted by severe budget cuts but localisation isn't the issue. Edinburgh is simply suffering more from the cuts more than other areas are Our crime landscape has changed and the policing hasn't been able to react to it We now have a MASSIVE housebreaking and car theft culture that other areas simply don't have to anything like the same extent for whatever reason. 25 housebreakings  PER DAY in  Edinburgh City. That's huge !!! Housebreaking all but disappeared in the 90's but its back with a passion

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jambos are go!

Pooling of public resources usually leads to resources being transferred to the Strathclyde area. In my working life I became aware of a scheme whereby all local authorities were required to set aside funds to tackle serious social need that arose across Scotland. The reality was that Strathclyde got virtually all of the money every year. Probably justified for social need and similar justification needed for policing.

 

Senior Police Officer saying on TV last night that Edinburgh can now call on resources from across Scotland. That may be the case but we need to know if the reality is that most of these shared reources go to augment policing in the same area year on year. Then we can make an informed decision. Is reducing violent crime in one area more important than cutting house beaking in another.

 

Or are local/public authorities organs of Centra, Government rather than instruments of their local electorate.

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Colly, I dont give two fecks about Police in Scotland , Either post or pre Police Scotland.

 

No, im not in Australia.

 

You're either a pish poor wind-up artist, or you really do have an axe to grind against the Police. I'm pretty certain it's the former.

 

I tried to give an insight into how another posters claim that the interaction between the public and the Police had changed. You decided to have a pop at front line Police by suggetsing they didn't work hard before Police Scotland.

 

I think the figures out about crime in Edinburgh show that Lothian and Borders Police worked pretty hard before Police Scotland.

 

Your comments are akin to blaming nurses for the failing of the NHS in hospitals. Something you'd never do because, let's face it, the Police are just as easier target to have a pop at.

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I predict housebreaking and other forms of robbery will increase massively, not just in Edinburgh but throughout the UK, in the very near future. Nothing to do with Police Scotland, everything to do with our current Governments policies.

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I predict housebreaking and other forms of robbery will increase massively, not just in Edinburgh but throughout the UK, in the very near future. Nothing to do with Police Scotland, everything to do with our current Governments policies.

Other than the unversal policing budget cuts applied by the Scottish government, partly because of underfunding by the UK central government, what specific policies will lead to an increase in housebreakings etc across the UK ?

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Other than the unversal policing budget cuts applied by the Scottish government, partly because of underfunding by the UK central government, what specific policies will lead to an increase in housebreakings etc across the UK ?

 

I'd suggest policies which have the folk whom are caught for breaking the law slapped on the wrist doesn't exactly do much in terms of putting folk off doing it. If I was tempted to go on the rob, the thought of doing X years in jail if I got caught might put me off, whereas the thought of a ?100 fine for stealing ?1000 worth of belongings might make that a chance worth taking.

 

Beyond that, look towards the 'policies' which have everyone so skint and struggling that resorting to taking what you cant afford is the only option some folk seem to think they have.

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Beyond that, look towards the 'policies' which have everyone so skint and struggling that resorting to taking what you cant afford is the only option some folk seem to think they have.

 

Correct. While I dont disagree with the general premise of Colly's post, such type crimes always rise during times of recession and weak recovery. With some of the poorest continuing to be hit, there will be a number who'll end up resorting to such type crime, thinking they have no option. We can debate the rights and wrongs of such thinking, but its pretty evident it happens.

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I'd suggest policies which have the folk whom are caught for breaking the law slapped on the wrist doesn't exactly do much in terms of putting folk off doing it. If I was tempted to go on the rob, the thought of doing X years in jail if I got caught might put me off, whereas the thought of a ?100 fine for stealing ?1000 worth of belongings might make that a chance worth taking.

 

Beyond that, look towards the 'policies' which have everyone so skint and struggling that resorting to taking what you cant afford is the only option some folk seem to think they have.

We have had a 'criminal class' in this country for many years now. The type of people who view thieving in any form as a perfectly valid first option rather than an act of desperation to feed the kids. There are more opportunities and welfare benefits now than there ever have been. There is more help,and support available than there ever has been. There are fewer excuses for resorting to thievery as a desperate act and a last resort. Yes there will unfortunately be a section of society who get lost and fall into the trap,of criminality, but the vast majority of crimes of dishonesty are committed by the greedy and the lazy rather than the needy and desperate.
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Other than the unversal policing budget cuts applied by the Scottish government, partly because of underfunding by the UK central government, what specific policies will lead to an increase in housebreakings etc across the UK ?

 

 

Correct. While I dont disagree with the general premise of Colly's post, such type crimes always rise during times of recession and weak recovery. With some of the poorest continuing to be hit, there will be a number who'll end up resorting to such type crime, thinking they have no option. We can debate the rights and wrongs of such thinking, but its pretty evident it happens.

 

 

Chester saved me typing a full response. I don't wholly agree with the first part of Eriks post but when people get desperate they do desperate things. 

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We have had a 'criminal class' in this country for many years now. The type of people who view thieving in any form as a perfectly valid first option rather than an act of desperation to feed the kids. There are more opportunities and welfare benefits now than there ever have been. There is more help,and support available than there ever has been. There are fewer excuses for resorting to thievery as a desperate act and a last resort. Yes there will unfortunately be a section of society who get lost and fall into the trap,of criminality, but the vast majority of crimes of dishonesty are committed by the greedy and the lazy rather than the needy and desperate.

 

When it comes to things like housebreaking I'd be inclined to agree with you a bit more. That's generally a scumbag crime committed by scumbags who would do it regardless. That was kinda what I was referring to with the first part of my post - there simply isn't enough at stake to make it a risk that's NOT worth taking for these folk.

 

However, when it comes to getting by on a daily basis and you've got folk who literally cannot make ends meet any more - I don't doubt for one minute there will be folk out there doing shoplifting and other 'petty' crimes which they wouldn't even have considered under different circumstances.

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Chester saved me typing a full response. I don't wholly agree with the first part of Eriks post but when people get desperate they do desperate things. 

 

A lot of the housebreakers in Edinburgh aren't desperate in the slightest.

 

The fact they're cutting about in ?80 tracksuits and ?100 trainers makes this pretty obvious.

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When it comes to things like housebreaking I'd be inclined to agree a bit more.

 

However, when it comes to getting by on a daily basis and you've got folk who literally cannot make ends meet any more - I don't doubt for one minute there will be folk out there doing shoplifting and other petty crimes which they wouldn't even have considered under different circumstances.

 

That I do agree with though.

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A lot of the housebreakers in Edinburgh aren't desperate in the slightest.

 

The fact they're cutting about in ?80 tracksuits and ?100 trainers makes this pretty obvious.

 

As I don't know any housebreakers it isn't all that obvious to me.

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think housebreaking crimes will shrink, the SNP have a new proposal in the pipe line for reducing motoring charges and just handing out small fines for most offenses and removing all points from a license after 12 months, this should increase police time to investigate burglaries. more than likely increase motoring crimes, reduce an insurance companies ability to check on bad drivers so they will pass on estimated increased claim fees to all drivers.

 

sorted you wont get burgled but theres a good chance you'll get flattened going to the shops to buy summit for your house

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Its effectively the same point you disagreed with. :lol:

It's really not.

 

Shoplifting and other petty crimes that people because they are desperate for food or clothes for their kids I can understand. I don't approve of it, but I can understand it.

 

Ransacking someone's house and destroying their feeling of safety in their home so you can spunk the earnings on a third pair of ?100 trainers or a bag of smack I don't.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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It's really not.

 

Shoplifting and other petty crimes that people because they are desperate for food or clothes for their kids I can understand. I don't approve of it, but I can understand it.

 

Ransacking someone's house and destroying their feeling of safety in their home so you can spunk the earnings on a third pair of ?100 trainers or a bag of smack I don't.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Read the posts from my reply to Erik. Your second paragraph is what we've all agreed on and was where the discussion was.

 

Effectively, its the same point....

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I can imagine you standing on Lothian Road one night, with some big, ugly H1b5 fan about to punch your lights out and as the wee wee trickles down your leg, you saying your not going to be shouting for the Polis.  Think you might give a feck then.

 

We all need the Police, to say otherwise is plain stupid.

Really bud. Somehow I don't think so.
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  • 2 years later...
Maroon Sailor

Still a shambles then !

 

Does not demonstrate value for money.

 

Not surprised when the top female cop DCC Rose Fitzpatrick received 67 grand in the past 3 years for relocation expenses and the SPA met her tax liabilities of 53 grand !

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Space Mackerel
6 minutes ago, Maroon Sailor said:

Still a shambles then !

 

Does not demonstrate value for money.

 

Not surprised when the top female cop DCC Rose Fitzpatrick received 67 grand in the past 3 years for relocation expenses and the SPA met her tax liabilities of 53 grand !

 

Being from the sea faring fraternity, should you not be focusingon the missing F 35's for them new super carriers?

 

I reckon they could come in handy likes.

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Maroon Sailor
21 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said:

 

Being from the sea faring fraternity, should you not be focusingon the missing F 35's for them new super carriers?

 

I reckon they could come in handy likes.

 

The MoD is just as much a basket case as Police Scotland is.

 

Actually I think the MoD is worse than Police Scotland. Run by a bunch of nobs. 

 

However this is is a Police Scotland thread.

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The relocation expenses are ridiculous enough but the additional tax liability requires a full explanation and review.   The entire process of the decision / policy to award these payments needs some kind of inquiry.    What do these payments represent in fact?     Which party (employer or employee) decided that this employee would be relocating?    

If this officer has applied for a position which would involve relocation,  sums of money of this magnitude should not be paid out.    If she was relocated by her employer then some expenses are due but £120k will need to be explained.

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Space Mackerel
1 minute ago, Maroon Sailor said:

 

The MoD is just as much a basket case as Police Scotland is

 

Funny how all these cuts in public services and MOD sort of starts and coincides with ***** no paying their fare share of tax, especially rich elite Tory ones?

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MacDonald Jardine
2 hours ago, Space Mackerel said:

 

Funny how all these cuts in public services and MOD sort of starts and coincides with ***** no paying their fare share of tax, especially rich elite Tory ones?

It really doesn't. 

We have a bank collapse then an "austerity " government. 

Do you really believe the current situation is caused by people finding tax loopholes that didn't exist before?

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Space Mackerel
2 minutes ago, MacDonald Jardine said:

It really doesn't. 

We have a bank collapse then an "austerity " government. 

Do you really believe the current situation is caused by people finding tax loopholes that didn't exist before?

 

Where did all that QE go that the UK Government released, you know, our taxes, adding a few noughts onto the BoE's ledger? Did you see it? Did I?

 

Then ask yourself, see all that money that went to the Greek government that was bailed out by Germany, guess where that ended up, back at the German private ones no less. 

 

Where has all it gone then?

Clue 1 : its hot, sunny and Richard Branson has an island there

Clue 2 : Mrs May goes hiking there and HSBC are constantly fined for laundering drug money in this country but no one goes to jail.

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MacDonald Jardine
4 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said:

 

Where did all that QE go that the UK Government released, you know, our taxes, adding a few noughts onto the BoE's ledger? Did you see it? Did I?

 

Then ask yourself, see all that money that went to the Greek government that was bailed out by Germany, guess where that ended up, back at the German private ones no less. 

 

Where has all it gone then?

Clue 1 : its hot, sunny and Richard Branson has an island there

Clue 2 : Mrs May goes hiking there and HSBC are constantly fined for laundering drug money in this country but no one goes to jail.

I have no idea what this means.

You'll probably say that proves your point. 

However, if it's that simple explain it and convert idiots like me.

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Maroon Sailor
3 minutes ago, MacDonald Jardine said:

I have no idea what this means.

You'll probably say that proves your point. 

However, if it's that simple explain it and convert idiots like me.

 

It's called good deflective tactics form the farce that Police Scotland is.

 

 

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Space Mackerel
2 minutes ago, MacDonald Jardine said:

I have no idea what this means.

You'll probably say that proves your point. 

However, if it's that simple explain it and convert idiots like me.

 

You know nothing about Quantitative Easing and how the UK taxpayer bailed out the banks?

You just said in the post above mines that it was all to do with a banking collapse and austerity? I assumed you followed the money trail after and deduced that it most of it ended up in private individuals pockets? Very wealthy ones too.

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MacDonald Jardine
1 minute ago, Space Mackerel said:

 

You know nothing about Quantitative Easing and how the UK taxpayer bailed out the banks?

You just said in the post above mines that it was all to do with a banking collapse and austerity? I assumed you followed the money trail after and deduced that it most of it ended up in private individuals pockets? Very wealthy ones too.

Okay with you now and I don't disagree with some of this.

As ever you're too simplistic though. 

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Space Mackerel
3 minutes ago, Maroon Sailor said:

 

It's called good deflective tactics form the farce that Police Scotland is.

 

 

 

Deflective? :lol:

Youre just a bit stupid to piece the global financial jigsaw together.

 

10 lashes at dawn.

 

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Space Mackerel
9 minutes ago, MacDonald Jardine said:

Okay with you now and I don't disagree with some of this.

As ever you're too simplistic though. 

 

Simplistic? Ok.

The Magic Money Tree that doesn't exist according to May is in Bermuda and the Cayman Islands along with trillions of other pounds. You can add Monaco, Switzerland and various African countries under defacto mercenary British rule throughout the years. Ask Mark Thatcher.

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