British drug mules

[scott_jambo]

Why, because it happens to be my opinion? Why should I spare any sympathy for addicts - I prefer to save my sympathy for those who, in my eyes, deserve it. Not those who got into such a situation through their own choice - because it was their choice in the first place. If you don't like that point of view then tough...

 

Wow.

 

Welcome back.

[Seglespaan]

I've got to say I am surprised with the lack of empathy on this thread. You may have noticed my earlier post but here is a slightly more up to date version of my thoughts.

 

I'm fairly convinced the following isn't a mile away from what happened here.

 

These girls went to Ibiza, enjoyed many weeks of partying and mixed with / were targeted by the gentlemen that organised their trip to Peru. Today I read that one of the girls claimed they met the "cockney" the night she was led astray. But also in today's press, a chap from Scotland claimed he had very nearly fallen into the same trap, and also that the "cockney" was pictured on the Scottish girls Facebook multiple times. Which leads me to believe that they had socialised while in Ibiza.

 

I reckon its likely that they were offered drink and drugs under the guise of "don't worry about it, we'll get this" for many nights only to be told further down the line that they owed a chunk of money. At which point they had their passports taken from them and were told that the only way out was to make the trip to Peru. The Scottish girl claims she was threatened at gunpoint and also that they had information and pictures of her family and both her and her family were threatened.

 

At this point it's very easy to say, even under duress they knew what they were doing and should be punished accordingly. And I very much doubt they thought they thought they'd be bringing back anything other than drugs.

 

But to everyone that says lock them up and throw away the key. Have you ever been talking to a salesman, be it car, dfs, timeshare, etc etc and felt pressured into making a purchase that deep down you knew wasn't quite what you were after. Whether or not you made the purchase, the pressure you felt at that point very much existed.

 

Now imagine upping the steaks considerably by including the threat of the death of you or your family. Also, the guys in question make a living from preying on these people. They've hand picked someone they believe to be impressionable, and have years of "training" (if you like) in removing any feeling of control these targets may have. Add to that a group of what you believe to be South American gangsters waving guns in your face and I'd reckon this is an amount of pressure that most people would never experience. But we're not applying this pressure to Jason Bourne. We're applying it to 19 year old girls, that are essentially all alone in a foreign country, have no passport and thus no means of escape.

 

Have you ever watched The Real Hustle, professional conmen essentially convince their "mark" to hand over a sum of money. It all happens so fast the mark doesn't really know what's going on and you could argue are not really in control of their actions when the end up falling for the trap.

 

OK so that happens very quickly, and in the case of these girls it was stretched out over maybe a couple of weeks. But if every day someone carefully plays their role to confuse, frighten or persuade you to do what they want, in foreign countries under immense pressure, terrified and alone. Can you honestly say that these girls deserve to face, most likely 2-3 years in one of the toughest female prisons on the planet, under threat of rape, violence and a likely hood they could become Class A drug addicts, or maybe catch TB or HIV. To be honest, god only knows what they might have to do to survive in that prison.

 

I fully believe these girls knew they were trying to smuggle drugs across a border. Do I believe they deserve what the next few years will bring. No. Not at all. There are many violent criminals in this country that are 100% in control of their actions, and intend far worse than I believe these girls did, that will never undergo the torture these girls will.

[Heres Rixxy]

I've got to say I am surprised with the lack of empathy on this thread. You may have noticed my earlier post but here is a slightly more up to date version of my thoughts.

 

I'm fairly convinced the following isn't a mile away from what happened here.

 

These girls went to Ibiza, enjoyed many weeks of partying and mixed with / were targeted by the gentlemen that organised their trip to Peru. Today I read that one of the girls claimed they met the "cockney" the night she was led astray. But also in today's press, a chap from Scotland claimed he had very nearly fallen into the same trap, and also that the "cockney" was pictured on the Scottish girls Facebook multiple times. Which leads me to believe that they had socialised while in Ibiza.

 

I reckon its likely that they were offered drink and drugs under the guise of "don't worry about it, we'll get this" for many nights only to be told further down the line that they owed a chunk of money. At which point they had their passports taken from them and were told that the only way out was to make the trip to Peru. The Scottish girl claims she was threatened at gunpoint and also that they had information and pictures of her family and both her and her family were threatened.

 

At this point it's very easy to say, even under duress they knew what they were doing and should be punished accordingly. And I very much doubt they thought they thought they'd be bringing back anything other than drugs.

 

But to everyone that says lock them up and throw away the key. Have you ever been talking to a salesman, be it car, dfs, timeshare, etc etc and felt pressured into making a purchase that deep down you knew wasn't quite what you were after. Whether or not you made the purchase, the pressure you felt at that point very much existed.

 

Now imagine upping the steaks considerably by including the threat of the death of you or your family. Also, the guys in question make a living from preying on these people. They've hand picked someone they believe to be impressionable, and have years of "training" (if you like) in removing any feeling of control these targets may have. Add to that a group of what you believe to be South American gangsters waving guns in your face and I'd reckon this is an amount of pressure that most people would never experience. But we're not applying this pressure to Jason Bourne. We're applying it to 19 year old girls, that are essentially all alone in a foreign country, have no passport and thus no means of escape.

 

Have you ever watched The Real Hustle, professional conmen essentially convince their "mark" to hand over a sum of money. It all happens so fast the mark doesn't really know what's going on and you could argue are not really in control of their actions when the end up falling for the trap.

 

OK so that happens very quickly, and in the case of these girls it was stretched out over maybe a couple of weeks. But if every day someone carefully plays their role to confuse, frighten or persuade you to do what they want, in foreign countries under immense pressure, terrified and alone. Can you honestly say that these girls deserve to face, most likely 2-3 years in one of the toughest female prisons on the planet, under threat of rape, violence and a likely hood they could become Class A drug addicts, or maybe catch TB or HIV. To be honest, god only knows what they might have to do to survive in that prison.

 

I fully believe these girls knew they were trying to smuggle drugs across a border. Do I believe they deserve what the next few years will bring. No. Not at all. There are many violent criminals in this country that are 100% in control of their actions, and intend far worse than I believe these girls did, that will never undergo the torture these girls will.

 

Nail. On. Head.

[kitster]

I've got to say I am surprised with the lack of empathy on this thread. You may have noticed my earlier post but here is a slightly more up to date version of my thoughts.

 

I'm fairly convinced the following isn't a mile away from what happened here.

 

These girls went to Ibiza, enjoyed many weeks of partying and mixed with / were targeted by the gentlemen that organised their trip to Peru. Today I read that one of the girls claimed they met the "cockney" the night she was led astray. But also in today's press, a chap from Scotland claimed he had very nearly fallen into the same trap, and also that the "cockney" was pictured on the Scottish girls Facebook multiple times. Which leads me to believe that they had socialised while in Ibiza.

 

I reckon its likely that they were offered drink and drugs under the guise of "don't worry about it, we'll get this" for many nights only to be told further down the line that they owed a chunk of money. At which point they had their passports taken from them and were told that the only way out was to make the trip to Peru. The Scottish girl claims she was threatened at gunpoint and also that they had information and pictures of her family and both her and her family were threatened.

 

At this point it's very easy to say, even under duress they knew what they were doing and should be punished accordingly. And I very much doubt they thought they thought they'd be bringing back anything other than drugs.

 

But to everyone that says lock them up and throw away the key. Have you ever been talking to a salesman, be it car, dfs, timeshare, etc etc and felt pressured into making a purchase that deep down you knew wasn't quite what you were after. Whether or not you made the purchase, the pressure you felt at that point very much existed.

 

Now imagine upping the steaks considerably by including the threat of the death of you or your family. Also, the guys in question make a living from preying on these people. They've hand picked someone they believe to be impressionable, and have years of "training" (if you like) in removing any feeling of control these targets may have. Add to that a group of what you believe to be South American gangsters waving guns in your face and I'd reckon this is an amount of pressure that most people would never experience. But we're not applying this pressure to Jason Bourne. We're applying it to 19 year old girls, that are essentially all alone in a foreign country, have no passport and thus no means of escape.

 

Have you ever watched The Real Hustle, professional conmen essentially convince their "mark" to hand over a sum of money. It all happens so fast the mark doesn't really know what's going on and you could argue are not really in control of their actions when the end up falling for the trap.

 

OK so that happens very quickly, and in the case of these girls it was stretched out over maybe a couple of weeks. But if every day someone carefully plays their role to confuse, frighten or persuade you to do what they want, in foreign countries under immense pressure, terrified and alone. Can you honestly say that these girls deserve to face, most likely 2-3 years in one of the toughest female prisons on the planet, under threat of rape, violence and a likely hood they could become Class A drug addicts, or maybe catch TB or HIV. To be honest, god only knows what they might have to do to survive in that prison.

 

I fully believe these girls knew they were trying to smuggle drugs across a border. Do I believe they deserve what the next few years will bring. No. Not at all. There are many violent criminals in this country that are 100% in control of their actions, and intend far worse than I believe these girls did, that will never undergo the torture these girls will.

 

Very well said. I completely agree. We don't know the facts or the situation about the case so 'never truelly understand someone until you've stood in their shoes and walked around in them'

[IMA MAROON]

 

 

Hate to say it but it is working....lowest rates of new heroin users since records began.

 

 

Doctors handing Methadone out for free, come and get it, as much as you want.

 

Doctors killing their patients.

[deesidejambo]

Doctors handing Methadone out for free, come and get it, as much as you want.

 

Doctors killing their patients.

 

Also coke is now the fashionable drug of choice.

[JKBMod 6]

Thread open. Any more trolling or abuse on this thread will result in suspensions. Please be mindful of the forum rules when posting. Thanks.

[JC]

I've got to say I am surprised with the lack of empathy on this thread. You may have noticed my earlier post but here is a slightly more up to date version of my thoughts.

 

I'm fairly convinced the following isn't a mile away from what happened here.

 

These girls went to Ibiza, enjoyed many weeks of partying and mixed with / were targeted by the gentlemen that organised their trip to Peru. Today I read that one of the girls claimed they met the "cockney" the night she was led astray. But also in today's press, a chap from Scotland claimed he had very nearly fallen into the same trap, and also that the "cockney" was pictured on the Scottish girls Facebook multiple times. Which leads me to believe that they had socialised while in Ibiza.

 

I reckon its likely that they were offered drink and drugs under the guise of "don't worry about it, we'll get this" for many nights only to be told further down the line that they owed a chunk of money. At which point they had their passports taken from them and were told that the only way out was to make the trip to Peru. The Scottish girl claims she was threatened at gunpoint and also that they had information and pictures of her family and both her and her family were threatened.

 

At this point it's very easy to say, even under duress they knew what they were doing and should be punished accordingly. And I very much doubt they thought they thought they'd be bringing back anything other than drugs.

 

But to everyone that says lock them up and throw away the key. Have you ever been talking to a salesman, be it car, dfs, timeshare, etc etc and felt pressured into making a purchase that deep down you knew wasn't quite what you were after. Whether or not you made the purchase, the pressure you felt at that point very much existed.

 

Now imagine upping the steaks considerably by including the threat of the death of you or your family. Also, the guys in question make a living from preying on these people. They've hand picked someone they believe to be impressionable, and have years of "training" (if you like) in removing any feeling of control these targets may have. Add to that a group of what you believe to be South American gangsters waving guns in your face and I'd reckon this is an amount of pressure that most people would never experience. But we're not applying this pressure to Jason Bourne. We're applying it to 19 year old girls, that are essentially all alone in a foreign country, have no passport and thus no means of escape.

 

Have you ever watched The Real Hustle, professional conmen essentially convince their "mark" to hand over a sum of money. It all happens so fast the mark doesn't really know what's going on and you could argue are not really in control of their actions when the end up falling for the trap.

 

OK so that happens very quickly, and in the case of these girls it was stretched out over maybe a couple of weeks. But if every day someone carefully plays their role to confuse, frighten or persuade you to do what they want, in foreign countries under immense pressure, terrified and alone. Can you honestly say that these girls deserve to face, most likely 2-3 years in one of the toughest female prisons on the planet, under threat of rape, violence and a likely hood they could become Class A drug addicts, or maybe catch TB or HIV. To be honest, god only knows what they might have to do to survive in that prison.

 

I fully believe these girls knew they were trying to smuggle drugs across a border. Do I believe they deserve what the next few years will bring. No. Not at all. There are many violent criminals in this country that are 100% in control of their actions, and intend far worse than I believe these girls did, that will never undergo the torture these girls will.

 

This all sounds very plausible however the girls behaviour since they were arrested doesn't strike me as that of someone who has had their life threatened. They appear far too confident and sure of themselves. If their changing stories are to be believed I think you'd be pretty shook up at the fact that you'd just been taken by force to another country and had your life threatened and your families. Christ that is going to do some serious damage to your head and mental well being. When these girls were interviewed in front of the camera they didn't come across as two daft caught in the headlights. There was also a report on itv news yesterday that the two of them could be heard singing 'you're just two good to be true' from their cells.

[The People's Chimp]

[removed by moderator]

 

Dire.

 

Please try not to derail an interesting thread with your shan patter.

[Maroon Sailor]

 

 

 

This all sounds very plausible however the girls behaviour since they were arrested doesn't strike me as that of someone who has had their life threatened. They appear far too confident and sure of themselves. If their changing stories are to be believed I think you'd be pretty shook up at the fact that you'd just been taken by force to another country and had your life threatened and your families. Christ that is going to do some serious damage to your head and mental well being. When these girls were interviewed in front of the camera they didn't come across as two daft caught in the headlights. There was also a report on itv news yesterday that the two of them could be heard singing 'you're just two good to be true' from their cells.

 

 

I think you have to take in to account that the realisation of what has happened and the consequences of it all may not have sunk in yet.

 

Some reports say they have been crying themselves to sleep, so you have to be your own judge on what we are being fed through the media.

 

[Franklin Delano Bluth]

 

 

 

This all sounds very plausible however the girls behaviour since they were arrested doesn't strike me as that of someone who has had their life threatened. They appear far too confident and sure of themselves. If their changing stories are to be believed I think you'd be pretty shook up at the fact that you'd just been taken by force to another country and had your life threatened and your families. Christ that is going to do some serious damage to your head and mental well being. When these girls were interviewed in front of the camera they didn't come across as two daft caught in the headlights. There was also a report on itv news yesterday that the two of them could be heard singing 'you're just two good to be true' from their cells.

 

God forbid someone in that situation tries to be positive in anyway.

 

I knew if I was looking at a stint in a Peruvian prison for drug trafficking, I would try to make myself as happy and positive as I could, rather than plan my suicide and get depressed.

[Gorgiewave]

What Seglespaan says about pressure and doung something while knowing it's not right is true: I was pressed into buying a big bag of passion fruit (excellent, by the way) for ?24 two days ago. But had I had time to think about it (being in Mallorca) or if it had been illegal, I think I'd have gone to the police. One thing is being under pressure and another is keeping doing something.

[Gershwin]

 

Dire.

 

Please try not to derail an interesting thread with your shan patter.

 

[JC]

 

 

 

God forbid someone in that situation tries to be positive in anyway.

 

I knew if I was looking at a stint in a Peruvian prison for drug trafficking, I would try to make myself as happy and positive as I could, rather than plan my suicide and get depressed.

 

If you found yourself in a Peruvian jail facing drugs charges you'd be absolutely shiteing yourself at the possible consequences. Someone trying to think positively would suggest they have accepted what they have done. Just throwing that out there.

[The People's Chimp]

What Seglespaan says about pressure and doung something while knowing it's not right is true: I was pressed into buying a big bag of passion fruit (excellent, by the way) for ?24 two days ago. But had I had time to think about it (being in Mallorca) or if it had been illegal, I think I'd have gone to the police. One thing is being under pressure and another is keeping doing something.

 

 

Passion fruit is great though. Hope you enjoyed it.

 

It was another very good post by seglespan. Food for thought, even at ?24 a bag, which is probably half the price of a bag of coke in Ibiza.

[Ray Gin]

Having just read a couple of books about life in South American prisons, I wish these girls the best of luck. They're going to need it.

[Gorgiewave]

I once saw a film called "The Lion's Den" about a woman's prison in Argentina. If it's like that, it'll be a minor miracle if they get out intact.

[Maroon Sailor]

 

Having just read a couple of books about life in South American prisons, I wish these girls the best of luck. They're going to need it.

 

They'll end up in Cornton Vale

[Taffin]

I feel real sympathy for them. They have fallen into a horrible trap by the sounds of it and desperation led them to make some terrible choices. It is such a waste of their young lives and the real criminals are the ones that led them into this.

 

That said, many people have desperate scenarios that force them into crime, it doesn't make them evil, but equally it is not an excuse. The drug trade in Peru ruins many peoples lives both locally and abroad; unfortunately the girls must be punished to the full extent of the law.

[deesidejambo]

If they are smart they will fess up and try to plea-bargain for a short sentence by giving information leading to the arresting of the gangsters. That would be a good outcome for all.

 

However already reported is that the Irish Girl intends to deny doing anything wrong and try to get off altogether.

 

That is not going to get her very far.

[Ray Gin]

If they are smart they will fess up and try to plea-bargain for a short sentence by giving information leading to the arresting of the gangsters. That would be a good outcome for all.

 

However already reported is that the Irish Girl intends to deny doing anything wrong and try to get off altogether.

 

That is not going to get her very far.

 

You underestimate how corrupt South American prisons are. Guards can be bribed to do just about anything. They'd never make it to trial if they took that approach.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

Whatever happens, I hope they aren't turned into British versions of Schapelle Corby!

[Gregory House M.D.]

Having just read a couple of books about life in South American prisons, I wish these girls the best of luck. They're going to need it.

 

One of the possible prisons is too dangerous for the consulate to even visit.

[deesidejambo]

You underestimate how corrupt South American prisons are. Guards can be bribed to do just about anything. They'd never make it to trial if they took that approach.

 

I was maybe unclear - what I meant was doing a deal with the Prosecutors and Court to provide information catch those who forced them to do this in return for a more lenient sentence. But I agree that the level of corruption is so high over there the Prosecutors may not want to play ball and these two will be the scapegoats.

[Creepy Lurker]

I do tend to feel a bit sorry for them, but just to play devil's advocate here they could still be as guilty as sin. I'd say it's probably somewhere between the two extremes of that and them just being two naive young girls. Either way, they'll have a very hard time proving that they were coerced.

 

Btw, if we all agree that we've noticed BJTart do you think she'll go away?

[Swanny17]

Whatever happens, I hope they aren't turned into British versions of Schapelle Corby!

 

What's the deal with Corby? Is she innocent, like many believe or guilty as sin?

[Greenbank2]

Doesn't expessing sympathy for them then extend to every junkie at the end of the food chain who pushes ?10 bags to feed the habit? Sure they've been stupid, they've been put under pressure, they're way out of they're depth. But they're where they are because somewhere along the line, the two of them have made some pretty bad CHOICES. Why? because they thought they could get away with it. Then it escalated out of control. Another couple of the "because you're worth it" generation who spend their time starring in a movie of their own lives, find out that there are consequences to the way you behave. They are accused of being drug couriers. Yes, circumstances should be considered, but they must be punished.

[Ray Gin]

Some very matter-of-fact opinions being banded about on here. Great that the forum soothsayers know with such confidence exactly how it went down. Perhaps you should be volunteer to be witneses at their trial.

[Franklin Delano Bluth]

Doesn't expessing sympathy for them then extend to every junkie at the end of the food chain who pushes ?10 bags to feed the habit? Sure they've been stupid, they've been put under pressure, they're way out of they're depth. But they're where they are because somewhere along the line, the two of them have made some pretty bad CHOICES. Why? because they thought they could get away with it. Then it escalated out of control. Another couple of the "because you're worth it" generation who spend their time starring in a movie of their own lives, find out that there are consequences to the way you behave. They are accused of being drug couriers. Yes, circumstances should be considered, but they must be punished.

 

Who said they made the choice?

 

Let's just be crazy and believe them that they were forced to at gun point? I'd love to see you make the choice and tell the gangster with the gun whose threatening your family to chase himself.

 

What's up with people refusing to believe they are telling the truth? Everyone thinks they're liars - it's not entirely unheard of for drug traffickers to force mules using threats and waving guns about.

 

*Of course they may be lying. But I'm not going to immediately think they are liars.*

[michael_bolton]

Seem to be a number of brave heroes on this thread who have probably never left Edinburgh. It's a known fact that in many developing countries the drugs smugglers are in league with the authorities and that they 'sacrifice' patsies on a regular basis to allow their gear to get through regularly. This is standard drug smuggling practice. Everybody wins, except the patsies. Forcing people to do it hardly seems out of character for these groups. Indeed, the guy in the press yesterday who says he escaped seems to back up their story.

 

These girls' story is entirely plausible. Regardless, they're going to get locked up for a long time. Absolutely zero chance of a fair trial. Amazing that so many people seem happy to see them rot in jail when there is every chance they are telling the truth.

[michael_bolton]

Any drugs gang who are smuggling ?1.5m worth of gear at a time are obviously quite a serious bunch. I'd argue that anyone who thinks such a group would leave an intercontinental drop to a couple of daft lassies picked up from Ibiza has no idea what he or she is talking about.

 

They were almost obviously set up from the word go. Common sense backs up their story, from the smugglers' point of view as well as from theirs.

[Seglespaan]

 

Any drugs gang who are smuggling ?1.5m worth of gear at a time are obviously quite a serious bunch. I'd argue that anyone who thinks such a group would leave an intercontinental drop to a couple of daft lassies picked up from Ibiza has no idea what he or she is talking about.

 

They were almost obviously set up from the word go. Common sense backs up their story, from the smugglers' point of view as well as from theirs.

 

 

You could argue though that the drugs actually have very little value from the "cartels" point of view. Yes its maybe 1.5 mil of lost prophet. But if x many mules were successful that day then the day was a success.

 

They don't really care who or how qualified that person is. They are able to produce more coke than they can sell and this loss to them will be tiny.

 

But I would agree that the girls were either used to allow another amount of coke to get through or are merely an expected percentage of mules that will get caught.

 

250 mules were caught in that airport alone last year. I'd think its similar to McDonalds losing a truck load of burgers in a road crash. Yes they could have sold them for 50k. But its wont hurt them in any way.

[moogsy]

It's amazing how so many folk on both sides are absolutely certain of what happened so early on in the case

 

Good posts from Seglespaan though.

[Seglespaan]

Just noticed the amusing auto correct on profit. I reckon 1.5 mil of foresight would be pretty useful.

[Greenbank2]

Who said they made the choice?

 

Let's just be crazy and believe them that they were forced to at gun point? I'd love to see you make the choice and tell the gangster with the gun whose threatening your family to chase himself.

 

What's up with people refusing to believe they are telling the truth? Everyone thinks they're liars - it's not entirely unheard of for drug traffickers to force mules using threats and waving guns about.

 

*Of course they may be lying. But I'm not going to immediately think they are liars.*

 

at some point they made a choice. Whether it was to succumb to the flattery of those behind it when they were first approached in Ibiza, whether it was to do a few complimentary lines, whether it was believe they were smart enough to get away with it. They stepped over a line and once on the other side, they were hooked. For what it's worth, I believe at some point which was too late, they realised they had no choice.

 

And they have lied. They said at first they didn't know they were carrying coke and then changed their stories. BTW - one obvious choice they made was to step on the plane to Ibiza from their homes. It's not like they didn't know the reputation it has. They will get hung out at patsies which is a shame. But they made the choice to enter an environment that offered it.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

 

 

 

What's the deal with Corby? Is she innocent, like many believe or guilty as sin?

 

She's guilty of being someone who takes up far too much newstime!

[Doctor FinnBarr]

Just noticed the amusing auto correct on profit. I reckon 1.5 mil of foresight would be pretty useful.

 

[Swanny17]

 

 

 

She's guilty of being someone who takes up far too much newstime!

 

I thought she actively tried to avoid journos etc, so much so that she won't even go into the visitors area in the prison?

 

However, if she is innocent, it's one hell of a shame.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

 

 

 

I thought she actively tried to avoid journos etc, so much so that she won't even go into the visitors area in the prison?

 

However, if she is innocent, it's one hell of a shame.

 

That was deliberately facetious but it does have a point aimed at the shitey news journalism in this country, where criminal notoriety is seen as something attractive (see the coverage of what was the first Underbelly story as an example).

 

My limited impression of the whole Corby affair is that she was set up. The way the media portrays it though is that Indonesia don't do fair trials and an Aussie shouldn't be locked up abroad.

[Rocco_Jambo]

Any drugs gang who are smuggling ?1.5m worth of gear at a time are obviously quite a serious bunch. I'd argue that anyone who thinks such a group would leave an intercontinental drop to a couple of daft lassies picked up from Ibiza has no idea what he or she is talking about.

 

They were almost obviously set up from the word go. Common sense backs up their story, from the smugglers' point of view as well as from theirs.

 

No idea about guilt or not but what you describe is pretty much the most basic smuggling technique used by South America drug smugglers to get stuff in to America. In the 60's and 70's when the cocaine trade was taking off the most popular route was paying for a holiday for 2 young American girls in the Bahamas then smuggle it to there and have them take it back in their suitcases. Cost only a holiday for 2.

 

As more money came in and techniques got more advanced due to economies of scale they started to use their own planes or narco subs to get the stuff in. Far more expensive and requiring far more specialist skills than two young lassies and a holiday for two.

 

The drugs will be worth ?1.5 million once broken up in to individual tenner bags and sold on the streets of Europe they probably have a value of about ?50,000 in Peru from source. Common sense doesn't back up their story.

 

 

[Seglespaan]

No idea about guilt or not but what you describe is pretty much the most basic smuggling technique used by South America drug smugglers to get stuff in to America. In the 60's and 70's when the cocaine trade was taking off the most popular route was paying for a holiday for 2 young American girls in the Bahamas then smuggle it to there and have them take it back in their suitcases. Cost only a holiday for 2.

 

As more money came in and techniques got more advanced due to economies of scale they started to use their own planes or narco subs to get the stuff in. Far more expensive and requiring far more specialist skills than two young lassies and a holiday for two.

 

The drugs will be worth ?1.5 million once broken up in to individual tenner bags and sold on the streets of Europe they probably have a value of about ?50,000 in Peru from source. Common sense doesn't back up their story.

 

Common sense doesn't back up their story? Having read the three pages of this thread, your'e going to have to elaborate a little.

[Rocco_Jambo]

I refer you to the post I quoted where the poster says common sense backs up their story because no drug traffickers would ever use people with the characteristics of these two girls as drugs mules and then my post explaining why they have and would.

[Seglespaan]

I refer you to the post I quoted where the poster says common sense backs up their story because no drug traffickers would ever use people with the characteristics of these two girls as drugs mules and then my post explaining why they have and would.

 

http://www.news24.com/World/News/Spanish-cops-smash-pregnant-smuggle-ring-20101114

 

You sure any drug lord has ever given a second thought as to who they use? Its a percentage game for them. Send lots, some will get caught some will get through. It has nothing to do with how qualified they are to do it.

[Seglespaan]

http://www.news24.co...e-ring-20101114

 

You sure any drug lord has ever given a second thought as to who they use? Its a percentage game for them. Send lots, some will get caught some will get through. It has nothing to do with how qualified they are to do it.

 

just re-read your post. I understand what you mean now and are in a way agreeing with me.

[Jambof3tornado]

Willing to work with the authorities, now they have been caught!

 

Nobody held a gun at their heads for the entire time and they had plenty of opportunities to hand themselves in.

 

Stupid wee lassies.

 

Hard lessons learned.

[ToYouToMe]

 

at some point they made a choice. Whether it was to succumb to the flattery of those behind it when they were first approached in Ibiza, whether it was to do a few complimentary lines, whether it was believe they were smart enough to get away with it. They stepped over a line and once on the other side, they were hooked. For what it's worth, I believe at some point which was too late, they realised they had no choice.

 

And they have lied. They said at first they didn't know they were carrying coke and then changed their stories. BTW - one obvious choice they made was to step on the plane to Ibiza from their homes. It's not like they didn't know the reputation it has. They will get hung out at patsies which is a shame. But they made the choice to enter an environment that offered it.

 

 

This. Sums it up for me.

 

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 4

 

 

[Ray Gin]

 

 

BTW - one obvious choice they made was to step on the plane to Ibiza from their homes. It's not like they didn't know the reputation it has. They will get hung out at patsies which is a shame. But they made the choice to enter an environment that offered it.

 

2 girls choose to go on holiday and this in your books mean they deserve the law book thrown at them and 20years in a violent hell-hole?

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

 

 

2 girls choose to go on holiday and this in your books mean they deserve the law book thrown at them and 20years in a violent hell-hole?

What sentence do they deserve though? A slap on the wrist and deportation home?

 

Life sucks. This is another example.

[Greenbank2]

2 girls choose to go on holiday and this in your books mean they deserve the law book thrown at them and 20years in a violent hell-hole?

They didn't go on holiday.

They won't get 20 years.

 

They went there to work and were working in a bar in San Antonio. The culture and environment that exists between ex-pat employees on the holiday islands is quite different from what the 2 week holiday makers experience. This covers everything from the tour company reps to the black market in legal and illegal products.They were part of this world.

 

I also see this morning ( and I accept that police have been known to distort facts) but the Spanish police (head of Ibiza's drug unit - who are not directly involved in this case (yet)) - are saying that "their claims run counter to known similar drug cases".

[Creepy Lurker]

Surely it's possible to both feel sorry for them and think that they should be punished as is normal in these cases.

 

People on both sides here seem awfully certain of what happened, but it seems to me that both are equally plausible:

• While working in Ibiza, the two girls get involved with these gangster types and are impressed by their money and perceived glamour. They build up a debt to them and are coerced into paying that off by doing them this 'favour'.
  
• While working in Ibiza, the two girls get involved with these gangster types and are impressed by their money and perceived glamour. They're asked to act as drug mules for a big pay-off and have their heads turned by the money on offer.
  

Imo even if they were fairly normal girls back home, both stories seem equally plausible. In that environment drugs are totally commonplace, and it'd be easy for young and naive people to completely disregard the moral side of whether it's right or wrong to be helping the trade in something that they were surrounded by all the time anyway. I suspect that the truth is somewhere between these two extremes: they'll probably have been quite happy to go along with the whole thing up to a point and if they did get to a point where they realised they were in too deep it probably was too late to go back.

 

Either way, they'll have a ***** of a time proving that they were coerced. The bottom line is that they should have a fair trial and be punished accordingly and following whatever precedent has been set...but that doesn't mean that one can't feel sorry for them. They're wee lassies who at some point along the line have made a very big mistake.