** Breaking News** No Buses On Monday.

[Guest]

Latest from the LRT website "We have an assurance from The Scottish Government that fuel supplies for public transport will be maintained. and therefore all services will continue as normal."

 

http://www.lothianbuses.com/index.php

[Sooperstar]

Latest from the LRT website "We have an assurance from The Scottish Government that fuel supplies for public transport will be maintained. and therefore all services will continue as normal."

 

http://www.lothianbuses.com/index.php

 

I'm not surprised!

[Tams bird]

Assurance from the Scottish government

 

I want a refund on my bus pass ....

[K1874M]

hahaha what a mess this is...

 

Its going to be like Mad Max next week...

[Therapist]

"We have an assurance from The Scottish Government

 

This will undoubtedly prove to be as worthless as all the other pledges Salmond has made.

[Boris]

This will undoubtedly prove to be as worthless as all the other pledges Salmond has made.

 

Hehehe

 

You just can't resist, can you?

 

Brilliant.

 

Me? I still blame Thatcher...

[maroonlegions]

They should stop all the a**eholes in their grey Vauxhall Zafiras from filling up, just to ferry their mutant offspring to and from school!

 

true, 4x4s containing ONE kid , 5 -10mis walk to school , lazy feckers eh.

[Nelly Terraces]

This thread is porn for taxi drivers! They'll make a mint if they've filled theior motors up!

[maroonlegions]

hahaha what a mess this is...

 

Its going to be like Mad Max next week...

 

ha,ha, were is Snake Pliscon when you need him eh, better watch out for the DUKE eh.

[Guest GhostHunter]

I was joking this morning at work, that come the end of next week, it'll be like Day of the Triffids out there.

 

It was agreed that I took it too far.

[Cigaro]

They're getting it now.

 

Crisis averted.

 

Rejoice!

 

All the old folk can travel to and from Sainsbury's for no reason again!

[Drew Busby !]

I was joking this morning at work, that come the end of next week, it'll be like Day of the Triffids out there.

 

It was agreed that I took it too far.

 

I dunno... nothing wrong with stocking up on tinned food, guns and ammunition in such times . If the neighbours start coming begging for food, then better to kill them first before they kill you I reckon, yes sirree.

 

Yee-hah !

[MackaysCentreSpot]

[MackaysCentreSpot]

They should stop all the a**eholes in their grey Vauxhall Zafiras from filling up, just to ferry their mutant offspring to and from school!

 

 

So glad I filled my Vauxhall Zafira up to the brim the other day.

 

And it's not grey and does not ferry any mutant offspring to and from school.

[Rawrrrrrrr]

The problem isnt so much this time but one would assume they wont just strike then backdown so we have to expect future stoppages too

 

Given the time it takes to stop and restart for a 2 day shortage, then after a few it could well be pandomonium and the reserves wont be enough

 

Id be kepting the arabs in now from the arabian oil fields and just telling this lot to do one

[Therapist]

If only the richard heads would stop panicking and fill up as per usual the petrol stations wouldn't be struggling.

 

Although Salmond's made a right pig's ear of this, we're fortunate we are still part of the Union. As a result I'm sure the proper government in Westminster and our southerly neighbours will bail us out.

[Therapist]

It seems a bit strange to me that IF there's going to be a fuel shortage, the oil companies have been told to prioritise petrol stations.

 

Wouldn't it be more beneficial to have public transport up and running so if there's a lack of fuel, people can still get around?

 

There are few events more damaging to a government - even a diddy one like Salmond's - than petrol shortages and/or rationing.

[Sexton Hardcastle]

Do people realise that the fuel from grange mouth really doesnt effect us too much. once the oil is turned into petrol etc is goes in to huge storage tanks (were i dont know) and is take from these tanks to petrol stations etc...

 

The only reason there is shortages atm is all the freakin bellends panic buying due to stupid media coverage. All wld be fine if they stopped as service wld return to normal (ish), not until the tanks run low we we be donald ducked. But hey its the british (scottish) public... common sense i think not.

[bighusref]

**Breaking News**

All downhill routes will continue as normal.

 

Hehe!

[Carl Spackler]

Am I missing something or could they not send tankers to a refinery down south to fill up whilst Grangemouth is shut? The price will go up but the stuff costs a fecking fortune anyway.

[Jarhead]

Imagine the chaos when oil finally does run out.

 

What a short sighted society we live in.

 

Well, at least you'll be alright living in the, ahem, city centre.

[Craig_]

Imagine the chaos when oil finally does run out.

 

What a short sighted society we live in.

 

There'll be riots in the streets.

 

God knows what they'll put in their petrol bombs though...

[Stewart MacD]

A total anti-social act if companies are told to give priority to service stations ahead of public transport.

SERVE THE PEOPLE!

[Gershwin]

Why don't they just drive the buses to a petrol station? Problem solved...no?

[Stewart MacD]

Imagine the chaos when oil finally does run out.

 

What a short sighted society we live in.

 

Unfortunately, one of the lasting successes of the Soviet Union is the result of the millions of dollars poured at arm's length into CND, Green**** and other anti-nuclear bodies, some loonier than others. One of the results of this is that Australia, with the world's biggest supply of easily-reached uranium, refuses to use it and has no significant university research in the field.

[K1874M]

There'll be riots in the streets.

 

God knows what they'll put in their petrol bombs though...

 

Glens Vodka

[Boaby Ewing]

Unfortunately, one of the lasting successes of the Soviet Union is the result of the millions of dollars poured at arm's length into CND, Green**** and other anti-nuclear bodies, some loonier than others. One of the results of this is that Australia, with the world's biggest supply of easily-reached uranium, refuses to use it and has no significant university research in the field.

 

Wait 'til China wants to buy some, then they'll soon start digging

[Stewart MacD]

Already contracted to sell. Cancelled the last government's agreement with India, though, because they haven't signed the non-proliferstion agreement.

[Therapist]

The situation is threatening to get out of control. Time to send in the Army to operate the Grangemouth facility. We can't have the country being held to ransom by a bunch of selfish lefties.

[Boris]

The situation is threatening to get out of control. Time to send in the Army to operate the Grangemouth facility. We can't have the country being held to ransom by a bunch of selfish lefties.

 

While the management are obviously selfish, to label them as "lefties" is just not correct.

[JWL]

The situation is threatening to get out of control. Time to send in the Army to operate the Grangemouth facility. We can't have the country being held to ransom by a bunch of selfish lefties.

 

Aye, they can clear up the trail of destruction from the last time I worked there about 6 years ago.

[IMA MAROON]

The situation is threatening to get out of control. Time to send in the Army to operate the Grangemouth facility. We can't have the country being held to ransom by a bunch of selfish lefties.

 

Forget the army, send in the Poles.

 

They are cheap as chips, ?50 a shift, and appreciate having a job.

[Therapist]

Aye, they can clear up the trail of destruction from the last time I worked there about 6 years ago.

 

Hmmmm.....might have known you were involved in this somehow.

[belly]

The situation is threatening to get out of control. Time to send in the Army to operate the Grangemouth facility. We can't have the country being held to ransom by a bunch of selfish lefties.

 

Send in the Army get a grip, they would not have a clue where to start running a complex plant like Grangemouth, the people that work there train for many years to operate the plant and systems in a safe and eficient manner. It's not like the Emergency services where the Armed forces can be sent in as back up. I also don't think the people are being selfish, they are striking for pension rights for which some have worked long and hard for.

[Deek]

I agree, the workers have every reason to strike. Ineos must be one of the richest companies in the world but have moved the goalposts in respect of the final pension.

 

For new starts it should be ok, as they will know the conditions when they join, but for men who have slogged there for years it must be a huge slap in the face.

[Guest S.U.S.S.]

I agree, the workers have every reason to strike. Ineos must be one of the richest companies in the world but have moved the goalposts in respect of the final pension.

 

For new starts it should be ok, as they will know the conditions when they join, but for men who have slogged there for years it must be a huge slap in the face.

 

Not totally up to speed on the specifics of the new deal but legislation does not allow them to remove benefits already accrued, therefore all monies already paid would be safe, from the date of change they would simply join the new scheme and pay the appropriate amount.

 

They will in effect have two pensions. One final salary and the new one.

[portobellojambo1]

Not totally up to speed on the specifics of the new deal but legislation does not allow them to remove benefits already accrued, therefore all monies already paid would be safe, from the date of change they would simply join the new scheme and pay the appropriate amount.

 

They will in effect have two pensions. One final salary and the new one.

 

I don't think it is even as complicated as that S.U.S.S., what you are suggesting is fairly commonplace, i.e. paying up a Final Salary Scheme and moving the membership to a Money Purchase arrangement for example. In this case, if I read another thread which was running in relation to this subject, the Final Salary Scheme will continue for existing staff, but rather than be non contributory they will now be expected to contribute a %age of salary per month. It would seem a new type of scheme, cheaper to fund and administer, will only be created for new members of staff. Existing staff will continue to accrue benefits under the Final Salary Scheme but will contribute into it, this is something which is common even in the financial services sector now, and is not really unreasonable.

[Guest S.U.S.S.]

I don't think it is even as complicated as that S.U.S.S., what you are suggesting is fairly commonplace, i.e. paying up a Final Salary Scheme and moving the membership to a Money Purchase arrangement for example. In this case, if I read another thread which was running in relation to this subject, the Final Salary Scheme will continue for existing staff, but rather than be non contributory they will now be expected to contribute a %age of salary per month. It would seem a new type of scheme, cheaper to fund and administer, will only be created for new members of staff. Existing staff will continue to accrue benefits under the Final Salary Scheme but will contribute into it, this is something which is common even in the financial services sector now, and is not really unreasonable.

 

Totally agree bud, happened to us a few years back, no-one is happy at having to start paying but have a look at the world, final salary shemes are just not financially viable any more. People have to wake up and realise they either change or the company dies. They are no longer affordable.

 

So make a choice a few more years non contribution then no job.

Or pay some money TO YOUR FUTURE!

 

Its one of the things i HATE about this country, no-one is willing to take responsibility for their own future. Either let the company do it or the State!

 

The MP schemes are not as bad as certain parties would have you believe. This with the flexibility of pension schemes now means people with a little knowledge can make lots of gains.

[portobellojambo1]

Totally agree bud, happened to us a few years back, no-one is happy at having to start paying but have a look at the world, final salary shemes are just not financially viable any more. People have to wake up and realise they either change or the company dies. They are no longer affordable.

 

So make a choice a few more years non contribution then no job.

Or pay some money TO YOUR FUTURE!

 

Its one of the things i HATE about this country, no-one is willing to take responsibility for their own future. Either let the company do it or the State!

 

The MP schemes are not as bad as certain parties would have you believe. This with the flexibility of pension schemes now means people with a little knowledge can make lots of gains.

 

Agree totally S.U.S.S., my work revolves around Money Purchase occupational pension schemes in the main (also deal with PP's SIPP's, Retirement Control, Buy Out etc. as an offshoot of what I do) and wise investors, people who take responsibility for their investments, and are able to follow how the markets work, can build up a substantial fund. It is certainly cheaper for the employer to run, but cheaper doesn't necessarily mean worse.

[Baird, King and Michael]

Totally agree bud, happened to us a few years back, no-one is happy at having to start paying but have a look at the world, final salary shemes are just not financially viable any more. People have to wake up and realise they either change or the company dies. They are no longer affordable.

 

So make a choice a few more years non contribution then no job.

Or pay some money TO YOUR FUTURE!

 

Its one of the things i HATE about this country, no-one is willing to take responsibility for their own future. Either let the company do it or the State!

 

QUOTE]

 

But the workers have been taking responsibility for their own future. That is exactly why they are going on strike!

 

Pensions are deferred wages.

 

The payment any worker gets from a pension scheme is not some gift or act of charity from a generous employer...the worker has had to work for that money.

 

The fact is that this scheme was negotiated by collective bargaining between the workforce and the employers. At one point the workforce would have accepted less of a rise in their take home pay in order to ensure the pension scheme was a good one.

 

Any variation in a pension scheme that is detrimental to workers is in fact a defacto reduction in wages.

 

If someone stole money from you and then you demanded it back would you accept them saying;

 

?Well I?m prepared to talk about this with you and a third party but your definitely not getting it all back!?

 

What would you do?

 

The union claim the company has spent the ?40m pension pot it inherited from BP by buying other businesses.

 

The company is run by James Ratcliffe, one of the richest men in Europe, whose personal fortune according to Forbes magazine is between ?1.3 - 1.8billion. As well as Grangemouth, INEOS owns another refinery, Laverna, in France.

 

The firm have attempted to justify this attack by claiming that a quarter of the entire money spent on employees goes towards funding the pension scheme, and wants them to pay 6% of their wages, phased over the next seven years, into the fund. Effectively a 6% wage cut!

 

It is the shareholders' job to invest in the company NOT the workers.

 

With profits running at between one and three million pounds a day there is clearly no shortage of money to fund the pension scheme.

 

The fact that elsewhere companies have successfully reduced pension entitlement is no defence for this kind of highway robbery being committed by a huge petro chemical company and it's billionaire owner.

 

It's nonsense to say that they have to accept this cut or lose their jobs.

 

The fact is this attempt is not a new strategy or a case of having to adapt to changeing global conditions in the "real world."

 

This is good old fashioned greed at it's best by a management intent on making even more profit at workers expense.

 

Good on the workers at Grangemouth for refusing to lie down and have the company walk all over them!

[Sooperstar]

This whole strike is a complete joke.

 

How many companies actually offer a final salary pension scheme these days?

 

Surely most of them were scrapped a good few years ago? I know that I only just made it into mine 6 and a half years ago now.

[Domokun]

I applaud the workers for this. It is a personal pain in the erchie for me but, luckily, I have filled up my motors to the brim (I wasn't going to, then saw the queues and empty pumps and admittedly shat myself) It's kind of a sheep mentality, but my two tanks should last me a couple of months if I drive sensibly.

 

Too many Tories around for my liking.

[Therapist]

Send in the Army get a grip, they would not have a clue where to start running a complex plant like Grangemouth, the people that work there train for many years to operate the plant and systems in a safe and eficient manner. It's not like the Emergency services where the Armed forces can be sent in as back up. I also don't think the people are being selfish, they are striking for pension rights for which some have worked long and hard for.

 

The Army would operate under the direction of plant management. Job done.

 

The lefties are being selfish. In the real world DB schemes are no longer the norm or a right.

[belly]

The Army would operate under the direction of plant management. Job done.

 

The lefties are being selfish. In the real world DB schemes are no longer the norm or a right.

 

The plant management, don't you think they are out on strike also, like I said in my earlier post the army would not have a clue where to start to run the plant, its not just a case of switching it on and using a remote control to operate it, there are procedures to follow, there may be something that doesn't operate as it should, the guy from the army would have to have knowledge of

A: where it is located on the vast site,

B: what the thing does, what would be the consequences of his actions

C: how the peice of plant actually operates.

so don't spout p*sh about operating the plant under management direction because half of the never even go out on the site.

I am talking from experience, I used to work at Grangemouth albeit in the power station, but I now work in the north sea, on what is probably the Highest Pressure/Temperature production platform out there, which is basically a miniture Grangemputh on legs. I have been there for 3 years and I am still learning the job and it is nothing like the size of Grangemouth.

[Jambof3tornado]

The Army would operate under the direction of plant management. Job done.

 

The lefties are being selfish. In the real world DB schemes are no longer the norm or a right.

 

Why the fekk should the overstretched Army/Navy/RAF get dragged into another strike which has nothing to do with them???

 

The armed forces cant strike when someone tells them that they are only getting a 2% pay rise and that its going to be staged over 2 years. They cant strike over conditions at work etc etc.

 

At the end of the day this is the governments fault for being short sighted enough to think that it wouldnt come to this. They should have applied pressure with the workforce and the owners to ensure the country doesnt grind to a halt and made sure that talks continued rather than have the plant shutdown.

 

If as someone has pointed out the workers are now being asked to contribute to their own pensions is the sticky wicket that are stuck on then I have lost all sympathy with them.

 

Get yer esres back to work and look after your own futures. Or feel free to quit your jobs and let someone else who is currently on the minimum wage earn the wages that you are on!!!!

[coppercrutch]

Why the fekk should the overstretched Army/Navy/RAF get dragged into another strike which has nothing to do with them???

 

The armed forces cant strike when someone tells them that they are only getting a 2% pay rise and that its going to be staged over 2 years. They cant strike over conditions at work etc etc.

 

At the end of the day this is the governments fault for being short sighted enough to think that it wouldnt come to this. They should have applied pressure with the workforce and the owners to ensure the country doesnt grind to a halt and made sure that talks continued rather than have the plant shutdown.

If as someone has pointed out the workers are now being asked to contribute to their own pensions is the sticky wicket that are stuck on then I have lost all sympathy with them.

 

Get yer esres back to work and look after your own futures. Or feel free to quit your jobs and let someone else who is currently on the minimum wage earn the wages that you are on!!!!

 

Nope, that has been taken off the table from INEOS. There is NO change to existing pensions. This strike is taking place due to FUTURE employees penions only. In other words people that don't even work there yet....

 

Anyone why supports this strike should give up on life. They clearly have no idea about reality.

[Toxteth O'Grady]

Nope, that has been taken off the table from INEOS. There is NO change to existing pensions. This strike is taking place due to FUTURE employees penions only. In other words people that don't even work there yet....

 

Anyone why supports this strike should give up on life. They clearly have no idea about reality.

 

 

Aye that is correct, I find it unbelievable that anyone would strike to protect the conditions of people who don't even work there yet.

 

It just seems like muscle flexing by the unions because they know they are in a position of power.

 

This sort of strike should be illegal in the same way that secondary striking is.

[coppercrutch]

Aye that is correct, I find it unbelievable that anyone would strike to protect the conditions of people who don't even work there yet.

 

It just seems like muscle flexing by the unions because they know they are in a position of power.

 

This sort of strike should be illegal in the same way that secondary striking is.

 

Indeed. These people think they live in the last century. Times move on. I am sure that INEOS have taking some liberties. There are two sides to every story after all.

 

However the deal the workers are on must be one of the best in the entire World. Final salary pension scheme with no contributions ? They don't know how lucky they have it.

 

They should get a grip and be thankful for what they have. If not they can **** off and work in Tesco.

 

Edit - PS. No offence to Tesco workers !! I used to do the tills in Safeway.

[Therapist]

The plant management, don't you think they are out on strike also, like I said in my earlier post the army would not have a clue where to start to run the plant, its not just a case of switching it on and using a remote control to operate it, there are procedures to follow, there may be something that doesn't operate as it should, the guy from the army would have to have knowledge of

A: where it is located on the vast site,

B: what the thing does, what would be the consequences of his actions

C: how the peice of plant actually operates.

so don't spout p*sh about operating the plant under management direction because half of the never even go out on the site.

I am talking from experience, I used to work at Grangemouth albeit in the power station, but I now work in the north sea, on what is probably the Highest Pressure/Temperature production platform out there, which is basically a miniture Grangemputh on legs. I have been there for 3 years and I am still learning the job and it is nothing like the size of Grangemouth.

 

Like any other business they will have disaster recovery procedures, business continuity procedures, and all general day-to-day procedures will be documented to the nth degree. There is no logical reason why the management or Army or anyone else couldn't operate the Grangemouth plant by referring to these.

 

Grangemouth workers GTF.

[davemclaren]

Like any other business they will have disaster recovery procedures, business continuity procedures, and all general day-to-day procedures will be documented to the nth degree. There is no logical reason why the management or Army or anyone else couldn't operate the Grangemouth plant by referring to these.

 

Grangemouth workers GTF.

 

I hardly think the army need to be called out for every industrial action there is. A tad OTT.