Attack in Toronto

[Norm]

 

4 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said:

 

Ive better things to do ?

 

Anyway, back to crazy white jihadists madmen running over people, that’s what this threads about. 

So far, the only reference I've heard anywhere that the guy is a jihadi is from yourself. 

[Space Mackerel]

1 minute ago, Normthebarman said:

 

So far, the only reference I've heard anywhere that the guy is a jihadi is from yourself. 

 

I just love the way that a lot on here suck up the news without a seconds critical thinking, about anything. And then you bite. There’s your lesson there. You can’t even distinguish  between satirical and real posts on a fitba forum ?

[Space Mackerel]

Quick 30 min lesson on media/power etc with A Marr and N Chomsky in attendance. 

 

https://youtu.be/GjENnyQupow

 

 

[Sharpie]

I seem to get hung up on the word "intent" on all these threads of this nature. Although many terrorists see suicide as the final act of their self thought brave, but to us terrorist act, generally their death is coincidental with the act of terror. The action of this suspect taunting a police officer to kill him is either an attempt at suicide by police, or a deliberate act to corroborate a claim of mental instability.  The full reason will not be established or easier to determine until the "intent" is established into the act of deliberately driving into and killing innocent people.

 

I cannot imagine the stresses in the police departments who have to deliver the news of the death of a loved to the unsuspecting families waiting for someone to come home. When tasked with the delivery of one message at least you have the support of the rest of your team, with ten dead there are not going to be many officers disconnected from this and all will need support. So many hurt and traumatised in so many ways by these reprehensible actions.

[peter_hmfc]

2 hours ago, shaun.lawson said:

Absolutely appalling. Those poor, poor people. Their poor, poor families too.

 

There will, of course, now be round the clock, second-by-second coverage across 24/7 news. There'll be the same slow motion footage playing in the corner of your screens round and round. There'll be TV crews interviewing neighbours of the attacker saying "we had no idea. He was so quiet". There'll be biographical profiles of the attacker, and attempts at cod psychology of why he did it: all with creepy music playing in the background to accompany dark, grainy, soft focus images. 

 

And above all, there'll be absolute, wanton ignorance of the proven fact that the more the mass media obsesses about lone wolf terrorist attacks, the more likely it is for someone to emulate it. Which given such attacks chill the blood like nothing else and hence, drive ratings, is perhaps the reason so much of the media covers these atrocities in such a way. 

 

The purpose of terrorism is to terrorise. The purpose of our media is, it would seem, to perpetuate that terror by sensationalising and even glamourising it as much as it possibly can.

 

You post some absolute shite some times don't you?

 

Today is not one of those days. The above post is probably one of thee most nail-on-head posts I've seen on this forum this year.

 

Absolutely to a dotted-i and crossed-t.

 

I am interested in seeing sources for where you see that it is proven though if possible, not at all for doubting the point as I've no doubt it's legitimate but I'd be genuinely interested in reading it.

[peter_hmfc]

1 hour ago, Space Mackerel said:

As ive said, make your own mind up. 

You can only lead a horse to water, not make it drink. 

 

Denying Sandy Hook is probably worse than giving Alex Jones an audience but when I watch his videos or listen to his supporters I do so with the same disgust and contempt I feel when watching videos of decapitation.

 

A vile contemptable creature whom anyone should be downright and utterly ashamed to show even a morsel of support for.

[shaun.lawson]

21 minutes ago, peter_hmfc said:

 

You post some absolute shite some times don't you?

 

Today is not one of those days. The above post is probably one of thee most nail-on-head posts I've seen on this forum this year.

 

Absolutely to a dotted-i and crossed-t.

 

I am interested in seeing sources for where you see that it is proven though if possible, not at all for doubting the point as I've no doubt it's legitimate but I'd be genuinely interested in reading it.

 

Thanks Pete! Start with this - but you'd need a subscription to read all of it:

 

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0047272717301214

 

More broadly, I hugely recommend Zeynep Tufecki's work on this. She's a great follow on Twitter; her book, Twitter and Tear Gas, is both essential and eye-opening; and here's a piece of hers. Albeit, unsourced as far as I can see:

 

https://www.buzzfeed.com/zeyneptufekci/dont-let-isis-shape-the-news?utm_term=.ooreAVvy8#.jm85z8nOl

[shaun.lawson]

8 minutes ago, peter_hmfc said:

 

Denying Sandy Hook is probably worse than giving Alex Jones an audience but when I watch his videos or listen to his supporters I do so with the same disgust and contempt I feel when watching videos of decapitation.

 

A vile contemptable creature whom anyone should be downright and utterly ashamed to show even a morsel of support for.

 

 

 

I put denying Sandy Hook only one rung above denying the Holocaust. But - FAO JKB Sandy Hook deniers - when Alex Jones is sued, look what happens:

 

http://nepr.net/post/alex-jones-backtracking-now-says-sandy-hook-shooting-did-happen#stream/0

Edited April 24, 2018 by shaun.lawson

[peter_hmfc]

18 minutes ago, shaun.lawson said:

 

Thanks Pete! Start with this - but you'd need a subscription to read all of it:

 

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0047272717301214

 

More broadly, I hugely recommend Zeynep Tufecki's work on this. She's a great follow on Twitter; her book, Twitter and Tear Gas, is both essential and eye-opening; and here's a piece of hers. Albeit, unsourced as far as I can see:

 

https://www.buzzfeed.com/zeyneptufekci/dont-let-isis-shape-the-news?utm_term=.ooreAVvy8#.jm85z8nOl

 

Thanks a lot ! I'll definitely give it a read some time. I think there is a similarity between terrorist attacks (bear in mind I'm not asserting this Toronto attack is a terrorist attack) and US school shootings. It's well known that after a massive school shooting there's a "contagion period" where other potential attackers see the infamy they get and want to get in on the action. Parkland (imo) definitely proved this. I think there is a similar problem with terrorist attacks. This is aside from the fact that mass-media coverage of people screaming for their life and crying in the street is an ISIS wet-dream, it is effectively their Superbowl half-time.

 

Also, no need for a subscription as I got it free through my uni online library .

 

15 minutes ago, shaun.lawson said:

 

 

 

I put denying Sandy Hook only one rung above denying the Holocaust. But - FAO **** Sandy Hook deniers - when Alex Jones is sued, look what happens:

 

http://nepr.net/post/alex-jones-backtracking-now-says-sandy-hook-shooting-did-happen#stream/0

 

It's not just denying Sandy Hook specifically (and not just the fact their evidence is so banal and tedious) but it's inspired the same mentality towards the likes of Pulse, Las Vegas and Sutherland Springs. I saw a clip of Sutherland Springs denier actually turn up at the church and call the pastor (whose 14 year old daughter was killed) a lying scumbag. His Megan Kelly interview showed he still believes it never happened, he was absolutely desperate not to insist it was real.

 

Anyone who follows him should take a serious look at themselves. I don't want to sound obnoxious but they actually do deserve to be looked down on.

Edited April 24, 2018 by peter_hmfc

[shaun.lawson]

 

And spot on Pete with everything you've said above.  

[Norm]

8 hours ago, Space Mackerel said:

 

I just love the way that a lot on here suck up the news without a seconds critical thinking, about anything. And then you bite. There’s your lesson there. You can’t even distinguish  between satirical and real posts on a fitba forum ?

Maybe it's because the opinions you post on here veer so wildly from sensible to crazy mental, it can be hard to work out what your intentions are and whether you're indulging in satire or actually believe what you're saying. 

[Ray Gin]

7 hours ago, peter_hmfc said:

 

Denying Sandy Hook is probably worse than giving Alex Jones an audience but when I watch his videos or listen to his supporters I do so with the same disgust and contempt I feel when watching videos of decapitation.

 

A vile contemptable creature whom anyone should be downright and utterly ashamed to show even a morsel of support for.

 

Well said. The guy is an utter cretin, playing a vile character for the cameras that strings along the less intelligent members of society and infects them with his poisonous bullshit.

[Unknown user]

7 hours ago, shaun.lawson said:

 

 

 

I put denying Sandy Hook only one rung above denying the Holocaust. But - FAO JKB Sandy Hook deniers - when Alex Jones is sued, look what happens:

 

http://nepr.net/post/alex-jones-backtracking-now-says-sandy-hook-shooting-did-happen#stream/0

That ****er, for five years he's been feeding the frenzy and provoking arseholes to attack grieving parents, no way he should be allowed off the hook with a last minute "yeah you're right" just because he's getting sued.

 

By the way, for those protesting about that "Gas the jews" prick's right to free speech, even in america you're responsible for your words. Do you really want ****ers like this to be able to say whatever they want without consequence?

Edited April 24, 2018 by Smithee

[Norm]

Just now, Smithee said:

That , for five years he's been feeding the frenzy and provoking arseholes to attack grieving parents, no way he should be allowed off the hook with a last minute "yeah you're right" just because he's getting sued.

 

By the way, for those protesting about that "Gas the jews" prick's right to free speech, even in america you're responsible for your words. Do you really want ****ers like this to be able to say whatever they want without consequence?

The key thing in the "gas the Jews" eedjit's case is context. It was clearly a joke. A shit joke, but to me, his intention was clear that this was a piss take and not him supporting the resurrection of the 3rd reich. 

 

Jones, on the other hand, clearly believes the messed up shit he spreads. Well, until he actually has to prove it. Then he backpeddles like ****. 

[Unknown user]

5 minutes ago, Normthebarman said:

The key thing in the "gas the Jews" eedjit's case is context. It was clearly a joke. A shit joke, but to me, his intention was clear that this was a piss take and not him supporting the resurrection of the 3rd reich. 

 

Jones, on the other hand, clearly believes the messed up shit he spreads. Well, until he actually has to prove it. Then he backpeddles like ****. 

I don't want to sidetrack the conversation too much, I said my bit plenty about that dude on the appropriate thread if you're interested

[Maple Leaf]

With the death of one of the injured pedestrians, the death toll in the Toronto attack has risen to 10.

 

As to the media coverage it is, of course, receiving ongoing coverage here in Toronto.  But I switched on to CNN last evening to hear their take on the crime, and I didn't hear a word about it.  They were giving complete coverage to the sudden decline in health of George H.W. Bush.  Go figure!

[Fxxx the SPFL]

6 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

With the death of one of the injured pedestrians, the death toll in the Toronto attack has risen to 10.

 

As to the media coverage it is, of course, receiving ongoing coverage here in Toronto.  But I switched on to CNN last evening to hear their take on the crime, and I didn't hear a word about it.  They were giving complete coverage to the sudden decline in health of George H.W. Bush.  Go figure!

There was quite a bit on CNN over here between ten and eleven uk time not sure if we get a different version from yourself.

[Maple Leaf]

3 minutes ago, Ray has bus pass hooray said:

There was quite a bit on CNN over here between ten and eleven uk time not sure if we get a different version from yourself.

I think it might be different versions.  We get the domestic CNN, and I think the UK gets the international version.

[Fxxx the SPFL]

24 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

I think it might be different versions.  We get the domestic CNN, and I think the UK gets the international version.

cheers bud will be over in Toronto end of may you never know might bump into you.

[Maple Leaf]

40 minutes ago, Ray has bus pass hooray said:

cheers bud will be over in Toronto end of may you never know might bump into you.

If you see an old fart in a Hearts top, be sure to say hello. 

 

I've been known to buy visiting Jambos a pint.

[Sharpie]

So the 25 year old student at I think it is Seneca College , who has been studying there since he was seventeen has been charged with ten counts of 1st degree murder, and thirteen charges of attempted murder.

He apparently had a high degree of respect for some other idiot who because of his realtionship with females killed a number of people in a rampage.  Todays killer decided he would do the same.  He also was quite open in expressing his feelings on social media.  He spent seven years in a facility for education surrounded by academics, and it would appear not one identified he had problems, or if they did done nothing about it.

 

One thing about a working class upbringing you soon learn to figure out folk, and later having attended the University of Life, learn to identify nutcases, liars and the other blots on society, this world and life in it can be paradise or hell, but we all have to act together and protect each other for the paradise. I am no stranger to death, some are understandable but some like the victims yesterday just break my heart. The one girl identified, young beautiful, with a future all taken away in seconds while she just innocenly walked on the sidewalk, while the killer sits in a cell, will be offered phsychiatric help, legal counsel, the baser instincts in me offer a totally different situation.

[Eldar Hadzimehmedovic]

Just me speculating and may be shite but he might fit the profile of ASD based on the stuff said about his schooling. Adam Lanza had an ASD diagnosis too I think. Tragic state of affairs all round. 

[peter_hmfc]

7 hours ago, Ray Gin said:

 

Well said. The guy is an utter cretin, playing a vile character for the cameras that strings along the less intelligent members of society and infects them with his poisonous bullshit.

 

He's probably on par with the Westboro Baptist Church tbh.

 

Americans can go on about the First Amendment all they want but it means they have to suffer pondlife such as them.

[Cade]

Seems that this creep was part of the "incel" sub-culture.

It's an off-shoot of the far-right for white guys that can't get their hole.

Incels (meaning "involuntarily celibate"), believe that there is some kind of global conspiracy that prevents them from getting a bursd. 

They openly advocate rape and think the world would be a better place if all women submitted to the sexual advances of any man that approaches them.

Recently, they have been advocating an "uprising", aimed at killing every attractive man and woman so that they can have their pick.

 

 

 

Killing ten people and injuring dozens more coz you're upset that you can't get a ride.

FFS.

[Norm]

25 minutes ago, Cade said:

Seems that this creep was part of the "incel" sub-culture.

It's an off-shoot of the far-right for white guys that can't get their hole.

Incels (meaning "involuntarily celibate"), believe that there is some kind of global conspiracy that prevents them from getting a bursd. 

They openly advocate rape and think the world would be a better place if all women submitted to the sexual advances of any man that approaches them.

Recently, they have been advocating an "uprising", aimed at killing every attractive man and woman so that they can have their pick.

 

 

 

Killing ten people and injuring dozens more coz you're upset that you can't get a ride.

FFS.

If true, that's even more of a sad sack act than killing people over a man in the sky. 

[Bridge of Djoum]

44 minutes ago, Cade said:

Seems that this creep was part of the "incel" sub-culture.

It's an off-shoot of the far-right for white guys that can't get their hole.

Incels (meaning "involuntarily celibate"), believe that there is some kind of global conspiracy that prevents them from getting a bursd. 

They openly advocate rape and think the world would be a better place if all women submitted to the sexual advances of any man that approaches them.

Recently, they have been advocating an "uprising", aimed at killing every attractive man and woman so that they can have their pick.

 

 

 

Killing ten people and injuring dozens more coz you're upset that you can't get a ride.

FFS.

Can't be right. Spacey told us it was jihadi-muslamic-ISIS. 

 

He knows best, you must realize that.

[Sharpie]

Apparently he joined the army but quit after two weeks of the training he couldn't handle, another report was that he was bullied at school, a sad pathetic individual who for his own selfish satisfaction has wrought sadness and misery on an untold number of people.

 

Coroner being very careful about being sure of identity of the dead, in the recent tragic bus crash a mistake in identity was made and parents were told their son was dead, whilst another set of parents were told their son was alive.  The two boys identities were mixed up and the news to the parents changed. How bad could that feel. So its good that extreme care is being taken in this case where not all the victims are Canadian, and may not all have been carrying I.D.

 

[Mac_fae_Gillie]

Another outsider, just hated the world so wants to exact revenge for his own failings.. sad loser.. 

Not much the police can do to ever stop these attacks.. No matter how pathetic someone is that is not a crime I know he was posting some bull on another moron in the USA guilty of attacks but that is an indicator of a loser not a killer and as many folk on the internet talk tougher than they really are the police can't really go around nicking you for been a dick.

 

[Sharpie]

5 minutes ago, Mac_fae_Gillie said:

Another outsider, just hated the world so wants to exact revenge for his own failings.. sad loser.. 

Not much the police can do to ever stop these attacks.. No matter how pathetic someone is that is not a crime I know he was posting some bull on another moron in the USA guilty of attacks but that is an indicator of a loser not a killer and as many folk on the internet talk tougher than they really are the police can't really go around nicking you for been a dick.

 

 

Absolutely true, sad but the only way you can really sure is when the crime is commited. its sad and can get you angry, but then if you go the other way and act proactively lives can be ruined again because mistakes of intent were made. Its life in this modern day of digital communication.

[Cade]

Very quiet thread

 

[Geoff the Mince]

4 minutes ago, Cade said:

Very quiet thread

 

Why ? 

[XB52]

2 minutes ago, Geoff the Mince said:

Why ? 

I presume because it's not been Islamic terrorism the usual suspects are not interested

[Geoff the Mince]

7 minutes ago, XB52 said:

I presume because it's not been Islamic terrorism the usual suspects are not interested

Yip . 

[Governor Tarkin]

32 minutes ago, XB52 said:

I presume because it's not been Islamic terrorism the usual suspects are not interested

 

Who are 'the usual suspects'?

 

I'm not sure an atrocity commited by some non islamic weirdo who can't get a ride is comparable to repeated atrocities commited at depressingly regular intervals across international boundaries by another bunch of wierdos who most likely can't get a ride either (no, I'm not talking about Western foreign policy).

 

International ideologically driven mentalness is clearly distinguishable from some arse just being ****ing mental.

 

Ayway, horrible stuff. Lhawson makes a good point re the media. Giving publicity to deranged homicidal loonies who crave some kind of perverse acknowledgement does nowt to deter the next spangle from doing likewise.

 

Edited to comment on somthing Bob alluded to earlier. 

Aye, I'd be in favour of having this chap despatched at the first opportunity

Edited April 26, 2018 by Governor Tarkin

[davemclaren]

I’ve never heard of this incel group before. Sounds like a real bunch of wierdos. 

[Eldar Hadzimehmedovic]

I feel this guy fits the profile of a terrorist quite comfortably. Mode of killing obviously intended to terrorise. Inspired by and seems to worship another guy who killed people for the same position of hatred and alienation. That same guy is revered on loads of online groups brimming with hate and potential danger. Common theme for me is men acting on their online radicalisation, whether it's ISIS inspired or guys who can't get girls, comes from the same place and just as dangerous it seems. 

[redm]

3 hours ago, davemclaren said:

I’ve never heard of this incel group before. Sounds like a real bunch of wierdos. 

 

Here’s a helpful intro. They’re toxic little creeps. 

 

https://t.co/EZ549VrN9S

 

 

[Cade]

This is the second mass murder carried out by Incels.

 

Surely time to add them to the list of terrorist organisations and shut down all their online groups and pages?

[Maple Leaf]

The identities of some of the victims are being released:

 

- a 94 year-old woman out for a walk in the sun

- an 80 year-old woman going to the bank

- a young single mother on her way to work, leaving a 7 year-old child with no known relatives

- a tourist from Jordan

- a 30 year-old woman who dedicated her spare time and holidays working for charities

- a cheerful young chef who was hugely popular with his colleagues and customers.

 

When you put names and faces to the victims, the tragedy becomes even more heartbreaking. 

 

[redm]

We’ve touched on this sort of subject before in the Shed. Just had a wee flashback to this from 2 years ago.... 

 

[shaun.lawson]

1 hour ago, redm said:

 

Here’s a helpful intro. They’re toxic little creeps. 

 

https://t.co/EZ549VrN9S

 

Yup. There's an, ahem, adult film actress I follow and chat with on Twitter (for her brain, genuinely. She's brilliant). And she gets constant abuse all the time from strange, creepy, women-hating men. I hadn't heard the term 'incel' before she used it when taking some of them out with the trash, which she does practically every night on there.

 

Reddit has taken steps to clean up its act, as has 4chan. But these losers will, no doubt, just congregate somewhere else online instead. They're also a spin-off from GamerGate - which was like a parallel universe in terms of the online wars it caused. But as we're seeing, online can spread into the real world all too easily, with hideous consequences.

[Sharpie]

32 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

The identities of some of the victims are being released:

 

- a 94 year-old woman out for a walk in the sun

- an 80 year-old woman going to the bank

- a young single mother on her way to work, leaving a 7 year-old child with no known relatives

- a tourist from Jordan

- a 30 year-old woman who dedicated her spare time and holidays working for charities

- a cheerful young chef who was hugely popular with his colleagues and customers.

 

When you put names and faces to the victims, the tragedy becomes even more heartbreaking. 

 

 

What is also relevant to me is the diversity of ethnic background of the victims, the whole thing actually when reported indicated the diversity of races living in relative harmony in Toronto, the police officers the whole emergency attendees and the public giving equal assistance to all, another example of how tragedy can show that no matter who you are or where you come from, deep down we are all just people.

[redm]

4 minutes ago, shaun.lawson said:

 

Yup. There's an, ahem, adult film actress I follow and chat with on Twitter (for her brain, genuinely. She's brilliant). And she gets constant abuse all the time from strange, creepy, women-hating men. I hadn't heard the term 'incel' before she used it when taking some of them out with the trash, which she does practically every night on there.

 

Reddit has taken steps to clean up its act, as has 4chan. But these losers will, no doubt, just congregate somewhere else online instead. They're also a spin-off from GamerGate - which was like a parallel universe in terms of the online wars it caused. But as we're seeing, online can spread into the real world all too easily, with hideous consequences.

 

Thing is, with communities like that, she must wonder if by fighting back she's making herself more of a target than she would already be. I don't doubt that will go through her mind. 

These people are pathetic and terrifying in equal measure.  

[shaun.lawson]

2 hours ago, Eldar Hadzimehmedovic said:

I feel this guy fits the profile of a terrorist quite comfortably. Mode of killing obviously intended to terrorise. Inspired by and seems to worship another guy who killed people for the same position of hatred and alienation. That same guy is revered on loads of online groups brimming with hate and potential danger. Common theme for me is men acting on their online radicalisation, whether it's ISIS inspired or guys who can't get girls, comes from the same place and just as dangerous it seems. 

 

Yes, absolutely. He's a terrorist. White Americans who've done similar are terrorists. The NRA is a terrorist organisation. Yet only Muslim mass murderers are described as terrorists. 

 

The way in which we use language to hide endemic racism is truly disgusting. 

[Eldar Hadzimehmedovic]

15 minutes ago, shaun.lawson said:

 

Yup. There's an, ahem, adult film actress I follow and chat with on Twitter (for her brain, genuinely. She's brilliant). And she gets constant abuse all the time from strange, creepy, women-hating men. I hadn't heard the term 'incel' before she used it when taking some of them out with the trash, which she does practically every night on there.

 

Reddit has taken steps to clean up its act, as has 4chan. But these losers will, no doubt, just congregate somewhere else online instead. They're also a spin-off from GamerGate - which was like a parallel universe in terms of the online wars it caused. But as we're seeing, online can spread into the real world all too easily, with hideous consequences.

 

Is that the other JJ in your life? ?

[shaun.lawson]

On 4/24/2018 at 12:14, bobsharp said:

He spent seven years in a facility for education surrounded by academics, and it would appear not one identified he had problems, or if they did done nothing about it.

 

One thing about a working class upbringing you soon learn to figure out folk, and later having attended the University of Life, learn to identify nutcases, liars and the other blots on society, this world and life in it can be paradise or hell, but we all have to act together and protect each other for the paradise. 

 

This struck a chord, Bob. Whenever we hear of some awful tragedy like this, invariably, there were people who should've realised beforehand, but didn't intervene. That's not just true of lone wolf terrorism - but child abuse, such as the Baby P case, too.

 

Sometimes people are scared to intervene where children are concerned because, in this ludicrous society we live in, they're afraid they'll be accused of paedophilia or something. In other cases, there's just too much bureaucracy: warning signs are missed, emails ignored. With the Manchester bomber, locals warned the police about him on five separate occasions... yet still nothing was done.

 

That can be down to lack of funding, chronically overworked and overwhelmed police, laws which are too liberal... you name it. But I also think it's down to how fundamentally incompetent most humans are. When I was a kid, I thought of the police as magicians, who magically ensured everyone was safe; and adults as these superpeople who never got anything wrong.

 

But we do. We all do. All the time. Just to give one tiny example: in one of my groups here was a 16-year-old boy who, it was obvious, had something wrong with how he spoke. Not a lisp or something like that; something much more fundamental. And he had major, major problems in listening too... because he was half-deaf.

 

I went to the school office and asked to see his file. Remember, this is someone who'd been through almost the entire schooling system here. And no-one had ever noted anything about his being half-deaf. I couldn't believe it. He knew he was; but was so embarrassed that he'd never told a teacher, had just done the best he could, and no teacher had ever noticed. Unreal.

 

And that sort of thing goes on all over the place all the time. People just don't make that extra effort to really pay attention. Perhaps because, as humans, most of us just aren't designed to.

[shaun.lawson]

7 minutes ago, Eldar Hadzimehmedovic said:

 

Is that the other JJ in your life? ?

 

 

Not her, no. She's a horrible racist. 

[Eldar Hadzimehmedovic]

5 minutes ago, shaun.lawson said:

 

 

Not her, no. She's a horrible racist. 

 

Sorry to labour this point, particularly on a thread of such gravity, but are you saying you have had personal interactions with TWO different porn stars? ?

 

Some boy. ?

Edited April 26, 2018 by Eldar Hadzimehmedovic

[shaun.lawson]

59 minutes ago, Eldar Hadzimehmedovic said:

 

Sorry to labour this point, particularly on a thread of such gravity, but are you saying you have had personal interactions with TWO different porn stars? ?

 

Some boy. ?

 

I am. One rather more pleasant than the other (though not as pleasant as I'd like, obv).

 

*cough cough* Back on topic.