Poisoned Russian spy.

[The Mighty Thor]

3 hours ago, Thunderstruck said:

 

The problem with that angle is that gangsters would have access to a WMD. 

 

If that is the case, the Kremlin seems curiously unfazed that the WMD is “out there”. If gangsters can get hold of it, why not Russia’s own terrorist threat. 

 

It reads like plausible deniability and there is even a chance that the perps have since suffered brain haemorrhages of the 9mm variety. 

Playing the same game the UK gov't is IMO

International diplomatic trade craft at work. 

 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

1 hour ago, coconut doug said:

If you are not prepared to cooperate then you leave yourself open to accusation that you have something to hide. If you try and fail and can show that the Russians failed to genuinely cooperate then you damege their credibilty. The UK authorities have reportedly refused to share fingerprint evidence, chemical samples, the contents of their UK visa application.and passport numbers at the very least. What would be the problem in sharing this info? If nothing is revealed through cooperation then maybe they could claim the Russians were obstructive. At the moment it is the British who are withholding evidence and refusing to cooperate. Is it not the case that the British know there is no point in cooperation brcause they know it has nothing to do with the Russian government?

 

              Where is Sergei? Apparently he has not telephoned his elderly mother since the attack.    

 

Personally I'd rather we gave the Russians everything they asked for and do it publically, but alas this doesn't seem to be the way it's done on either side, remember the Russians didn't cooperate with the investigation into MH17, so it seems to be the way these things are played out.

[Boris]

3 hours ago, Thunderstruck said:

 

The problem with that angle is that gangsters would have access to a WMD. 

 

If that is the case, the Kremlin seems curiously unfazed that the WMD is “out there”. If gangsters can get hold of it, why not Russia’s own terrorist threat. 

 

It reads like plausible deniability and there is even a chance that the perps have since suffered brain haemorrhages of the 9mm variety. 

That's a fair point. 

[coconut doug]

20 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

Personally I'd rather we gave the Russians everything they asked for and do it publically, but alas this doesn't seem to be the way it's done on either side, remember the Russians didn't cooperate with the investigation into MH17, so it seems to be the way these things are played out.

Outbreak of logic and common sense. Russia used their veto to stop a UN tribunal on MH17, would they do the same with Skripal?-

[Jambo-Jimbo]

4 minutes ago, coconut doug said:

Outbreak of logic and common sense. Russia used their veto to stop a UN tribunal on MH17, would they do the same with Skripal?-

 

Who knows, and I'd guess we'll never find out either.

 

Personally if I was in charge, I'd give the Russians everything we had (well almost everything, you always keep something back) and do it publically at the UN for example, call their bluff and when they can't pick your story apart you'll have exposed them for the lying barstewards which they typically are, well most of the time, and I'd do it all publically in front of the whole World.

 

But I'm not in charge and this doesn't seem to be the way the game is played, so all of this is hypothetical.

[ri Alban]

17 hours ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

Who knows, and I'd guess we'll never find out either.

 

Personally if I was in charge, I'd give the Russians everything we had (well almost everything, you always keep something back) and do it publically at the UN for example, call their bluff and when they can't pick your story apart you'll have exposed them for the lying barstewards which they typically are, well most of the time, and I'd do it all publically in front of the whole World.

 

But I'm not in charge and this doesn't seem to be the way the game is played, so all of this is hypothetical.

Any proof they're typical lying Barstewards or is that just a a state of mind programmed by US/GB propaganda. 

WMD, Brexit and Grenfell is proof that the UK  government are lying pigs. 

[jake]

49 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Any proof they're typical lying Barstewards or is that just a a state of mind programmed by US/GB propaganda. 

WMD, Brexit and Grenfell is proof that the UK  government are lying pigs. 

Yep.

Mind the chancellor of the exchequer warned us that a vote for brexit would see immediate tax rises and public spending cuts.

The current prime minister was also on the remain side.

Good point well made there .

?

[Jambo-Jimbo]

2 hours ago, ri Alban said:

Any proof they're typical lying Barstewards or is that just a a state of mind programmed by US/GB propaganda. 

WMD, Brexit and Grenfell is proof that the UK  government are lying pigs. 

 

Indeed.

1. When asked about Russian troops in the Crimea, the answer was there are no Russian troops in Crimea, yet there is lots of photos and video of Russian troops, blatant lie.

2. Repeat same question and answer for Ukraine.

3. When accused of shooting down MH17, Russia swore that there were no Buk Missile systems in the Ukraine, yet several were photographed and filmed moving back into Russia shortly after the shooting down of MH17 yet another lie from the Russians.

 

And that's just 3 off the top of my head, I'm certain there are many many more.

And no my mind is not programmed by US/UK propaganda because they also lie, WMD's for example, however I never believed it to begin with, and I told anybody who would listen that at the time as well, got ridiculed for it, but was proved right as time went on and none were found.

Not sure what the UK government are lying about Brexit & Grenfell, but they are covered on other threads so don't answer that, as you'll only derail this thread.

[Francis Albert]

Good article by Simon Jenkins in Friday's Guardian (where he is about the only writer worth reading in that comic these days). He rightly says there are no good guys in the murky world of espionage and few who don't themselves have blood on their hands. As he says if the British had succeeding in bumping of any or all of Philby, Burgess and Maclean after their defection no-one would have raised a hair. 

He also questions how many murderers or attempted murderers face an investigation by a squad 250 police officers for six months. There is zero chance of the culprits coming to trial and the resources would have been better and much more cheaply spent on offering the Russian traitor and his daughter better police protection.

The UK and other Western response is pure and wholly hypocritical political game playing and propaganda..

Edited September 9, 2018 by Francis Albert

[Ibrahim Tall]

5 hours ago, Francis Albert said:

Good article by Simon Jenkins in Friday's Guardian (where he is about the only writer worth reading in that comic these days). He rightly says there are no good guys in the murky world of espionage and few who don't themselves have blood on their hands. As he says if the British had succeeding in bumping of any or all of Philby, Burgess and Maclean after their defection no-one would have raised a hair. 

He also questions how many murderers or attempted murderers face an investigation by a squad 250 police officers for six months. There is zero chance of the culprits coming to trial and the resources would have been better and much more cheaply spent on offering the Russian traitor and his daughter better police protection.

The UK and other Western response is pure and wholly hypocritical political game playing and propaganda..

 

 

Tbh the issue isn't the 'assassination' or 'attempted assassination' it's the method that was used.

The guys a traitor to his country and whether he was our traitor or not is pretty irrelevant. If he was quietly bumped off or turned up in Moscow no one would have given a toss.

Doing so with a chemical weapon in a public place and then carelessly disposing of said weapon is the issue here.

Everyone know neither ourselves or the Yanks are angels, our intelligence services are *******s too but there's lines that you're not meant to cross.

Edited September 9, 2018 by Ibrahim Tall

[AlphonseCapone]

On 06/09/2018 at 11:44, Dusk_Till_Dawn said:

Amazing how people can ignore what’s in front of their eyes simply to have a dig at Westminster.

 

Mind you, now that their separatist hero has been reduced to crowdfunding by certain allegations, I guess it’s desperate times.

 

It's also amazing how folk turn any topic into a Scottish Independence thing. Baffling actually. 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

11 hours ago, Ibrahim Tall said:

 

 

Tbh the issue isn't the 'assassination' or 'attempted assassination' it's the method that was used.

The guys a traitor to his country and whether he was our traitor or not is pretty irrelevant. If he was quietly bumped off or turned up in Moscow no one would have given a toss.

Doing so with a chemical weapon in a public place and then carelessly disposing of said weapon is the issue here.

Everyone know neither ourselves or the Yanks are angels, our intelligence services are *******s too but there's lines that you're not meant to cross.

 

Also this gentlemans agreement (so to speak) of not pursuing/targeting a former spy or their family once they have been exchanged in a spy swap, that unwritten rule has now been shattered.

And I agree, if Sergei Skripal had been found hanging in his garage nobody would have batted an eyelid and few if any would have cared less, but to use a substance which potentially could have affected/killed hundreds maybe even thousands of British civilians is the issue here, it's the total disregard for the potential danger to the general public that's the issue. 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

Nothing to do with the Russians, aye right.

 

Putin has just said that they (Russia) knows who the two people are named as suspects, Putin claims they are civilians, Russian civilians, not criminals and hopes that they will come forward (soon) to tell their story.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-45494627

 

 

Edited September 12, 2018 by Jambo-Jimbo

[coconut doug]

22 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

Nothing to do with the Russians, aye right.

 

Putin has just said that they (Russia) knows who the two people are named as suspects, Putin claims they are civilians, Russian civilians, not criminals and hopes that they will come forward (soon) to tell their story.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-45494627

 

 

Who said it was nothing to do with the Russians?  Some people said they doubted it was the Russian state and that may well be the case. You could at least wait until they give their explanation before claiming victory.

I wonder if they will tell us what they did with the first pefume bottle i.e. the one they allegedly used on the Skripals and tell us why they discarded the other unopened one in a place where it could be found by any passer by and yet remain undetected for three months . Looks like they came to meet Sergei, were they set up?

[Jambo-Jimbo]

1 hour ago, coconut doug said:

Who said it was nothing to do with the Russians?  Some people said they doubted it was the Russian state and that may well be the case. You could at least wait until they give their explanation before claiming victory.

I wonder if they will tell us what they did with the first pefume bottle i.e. the one they allegedly used on the Skripals and tell us why they discarded the other unopened one in a place where it could be found by any passer by and yet remain undetected for three months . Looks like they came to meet Sergei, were they set up?

 

Plenty have said it wasn't the Russians, read the thread.

Who's claiming victory?  Certainly not me, I've said from an early stage that I believed it was the Russians, and I still do.

You seriously aren't expecting an explanation from the two suspects, are you?

I wouldn't be surprised that when they do surface on radio/TV that it follows a similar format to the explanation put forward by the two suspects of the murder of Alexander Litvinenko, basically 'did you do it, no.'

[Victorian]

Russian GRU nerve agent tourists have spoken.    Deliberately incredulous stuff.     Yet bacofoil heads will gobble it up no doubt.    

[Ibrahim Tall]

Disappointed at the interview tbh, hopes they'd atleast have went with the 'we were blackmailed into it by British intelligence' angle. 

 

[Armageddon]

Two poor Russian tourists, booked into a hotel to see the local 123m spire on the cathedral, there's been traces of novichok found in that hotel room, what are the chances eh?

 

Turns out the SFA compliance officer will lead the case against them.

[Ibrahim Tall]

1 minute ago, Armageddon said:

Two poor Russian tourists, booked into a hotel to see the local 123m spire on the cathedral, there's been traces of novichok found in that hotel room, what are the chances eh?

 

Turns out the SFA compliance officer will lead the case against them.

 

To be fair I feel sorry for them.

 

Go away on a lads holiday to visit a random foreign church only to have it ruined by slushy pavements, to top it off they get home and are accused of murder and centre stage in a new Cold War.

I hope they atleast got some free soap and shampoo to take home at the hotel or this experience certainly won't be getting 5 stars on trip advisor.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

6 minutes ago, Armageddon said:

Two poor Russian tourists, booked into a hotel to see the local 123m spire on the cathedral, there's been traces of novichok found in that hotel room, what are the chances eh?

 

Turns out the SFA compliance officer will lead the case against them.

 

But it wasn't the local 123m cathedral spire, it was a further 1hr 20min train journey away from where they were staying.

 

Travel all the way from Moscow to visit Salisbury only then to stay in London thus meaning that they had to take a 1hr 20min train journey to see the spire, to then only spend an hour or so in Salisbury.

Surely it would have made sense and saved a lot of money to have stayed in a hotel in Salisbury, rather than London, that way they might have been able to stay longer in Salisbury.

[Armageddon]

IMO they could have at least made it look like some sort of family/couples romantic break!  Nah they drop 2 guys in all the way from Russia to look at a spire then home the next day!!

[Jambo-Jimbo]

10 minutes ago, Ibrahim Tall said:

 

To be fair I feel sorry for them.

 

Go away on a lads holiday to visit a random foreign church only to have it ruined by slushy pavements, to top it off they get home and are accused of murder and centre stage in a new Cold War.

I hope they atleast got some free soap and shampoo to take home at the hotel or this experience certainly won't be getting 5 stars on trip advisor.

 

These slushy pavements?

 

Or these ones?

 

 

[Victorian]

And could not fulfill their dream of seeing Stonehenge because of the mud.    

 

 

[Rocco_Jambo]

11 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

These slushy pavements?

 

Or these ones?

 

 

 

Are those pictures not from the 4th March i.e the day they said they returned to Salisbury when the weather was better and everything had melted away?

[Jambo-Jimbo]

14 minutes ago, Rocco_Jambo said:

 

Are those pictures not from the 4th March i.e the day they said they returned to Salisbury when the weather was better and everything had melted away?

 

Tbh I don't know what the weather was like the previous day, but the point still stands, if they had stayed in Salisbury in the first place then they wouldn't have needed to make another 1hr 20min each way train journey the next day.

[Rocco_Jambo]

7 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

Tbh I don't know what the weather was like the previous day, but the point still stands, if they had stayed in Salisbury in the first place then they wouldn't have needed to make another 1hr 20min each way train journey the next day.

 

Sorry but your point was to suggest they were lying about there being slushy pavements by posting pictures of clear pavements that were taken the day after.

Edited September 13, 2018 by Rocco_Jambo

[Armageddon]

[Jambo-Jimbo]

5 minutes ago, Rocco_Jambo said:

 

Sorry but your point was to suggest they were lying about there being slushy pavements by posting pictures of clear pavements that were taken the day after.

 

I think they are lying about much more than just some slushy pavements, which might have been as they say slushy the day before the photos were taken,  however please bear in mind they are from Russia, so I'm pretty sure they'd be used to much more than a wee bit of slush on the pavements of a town in the South of England.

[Rocco_Jambo]

3 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

I think they are lying about much more than just some slushy pavements, which might have been as they say slushy the day before the photos were taken,  however please bear in mind they are from Russia, so I'm pretty sure they'd be used to much more than a wee bit of slush on the pavements of a town in the South of England.

 

Also bear in mind that Russia is the size of North America and some areas have a sub tropical type climates akin to the Mediterreanean. Bit of a lazy stereotype to suggest all Russians are use to snow without knowing more about them.

[Geoff the Mince]

35 minutes ago, Rocco_Jambo said:

 

Also bear in mind that Russia is the size of North America and some areas have a sub tropical type climates akin to the Mediterreanean. Bit of a lazy stereotype to suggest all Russians are use to snow without knowing more about them.

Well they dont look Central Asian or from the Caucases . . Safe bet that they're from west of the Urals . 

[Rocco_Jambo]

13 minutes ago, Geoff the Mince said:

Well they dont look Central Asian or from the Caucases . . Safe bet that they're from west of the Urals . 

 

I’ve no idea. I wouldn’t presume to know where someone was merely from there skin colour.

[Trapper John McIntyre]

Salisbury assassins ' fess up

 

[Victorian]

Only just heard these normal,  everyday guys' passports have sequential numbers.

 

Lol.     

[ri Alban]

45 minutes ago, Trapper John McIntyre said:

Salisbury assassins ' fess up

 

What films that again, Trapper. Is it 007? 

Edited September 13, 2018 by ri Alban

[Victorian]

8 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

What films that again, Trapper. Is it 007? 

 

Diamonds Are Forever.    Terrible film. 

[robroy1874]

Seems a reasonable explanation to me. Lots of Russian guys get fed up of clubbing/socialising with good-looking women and then after a few drinks, say "Hey, Sergei - you know what. Salisbury Cathedral has a spire that we have to go see - even in winter it's spectacular. Let's travel to London and then spend an hour in Salisbury and see this spire." Answer - Davay, let's go Bpris -seems like a trip to me!"

[Tazio]

47 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

Diamonds Are Forever.    Terrible film. 

 

Infamy!!

[Victorian]

7 minutes ago, Tazio said:

 

Infamy!!

 

Jill St.John was in it I suppose.   Decent Bond-bursd.    But so bad a film.    So much so that Ernst Stavro Blofeld was played by Charles Gray,   who had already played a 'good guy' in You Only Live Twice just 4 years previous.    

 

It's hard to be believe so bad a film could have been produced by legendary producers who had created the first 6.

[milky_26]

22 minutes ago, Tazio said:

 

Infamy!!

infamy, infamy, they've got it in for me

[CJGJ]

What annoys me is the thought that Putin somehow thinks people in our country and in countries who have any common sense will buy this fantasy

 

Juat how stupid does he think we are ?...……………………………………………………………………………………..wait a minute though this is the country that has voted for Brexit and the country where many seem to think Boris 'the philanderer' Johnson would make a good Prime minister......maybe he's got many of our citizens pegged after all

[Homme]

Putin knows we aren’t buying it

 

he is just trolling.

Edited September 13, 2018 by Homme

[Geoff the Mince]

Putin is a filthy rat . 

[Victorian]

2 minutes ago, Homme said:

Putin knows we aren’t buying it

 

he is just trolling.

 

Correct.    It's deliberately incredible to trivialise and mock.    They have no interest in trying to convince anyone other than the Russian 'voter' of anything.      They want everyone to believe they are responsible,   while at the same time officially denying it.

[Ricardo Shillyshally]

They are better tourists than hitmen that's for sure. 

[Victorian]

1 minute ago, Ricardo Shillyshally said:

They are better tourists than hitmen that's for sure. 

 

Yep.   They know all about Salisbury without having bought a little guide booklet at the railway station.     It's a pity the Wiki page didn't contain an error.

[graygo]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-45509697

 

The "tourists" speak.

[Victorian]

3 minutes ago, graygo said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-45509697

 

The "tourists" speak.

 

Peebles next on the bucket list?

[graygo]

6 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

Peebles next on the bucket list?

 

 

[Victorian]

Just now, graygo said:

 

 

 

[Mac_fae_Gillie]

Well they quoted 2 facts about the Cathedral so it must be true..

Putin loves this stuff, These daft shows are just we deny it now prove it.

And even if we do prove it he will declare it all false evidence.

 

So these 2 guys went to Salisbury to see a 123 foot spire and clock as we know when they arrived and when they left the city their trip can be almost pinpointed by most cameras, even got them on the nearest camera walking past a service station in the street next to the victims, trances of poison in their London hotel room too. Just need to poke great big holes in their story and Putin is proved guilty. now he likes to be assumed guilty but if proved that will be a first. And I bet our Int' guys are holding back just to let Russia and Putin dig a bigger hole.