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Accounts and AGM 2017 ( Merged )


2205ian

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On 18/11/2017 at 22:34, davemclaren said:

I was merely articulating the risks as I see them. 

 

18 hours ago, davemclaren said:

It’s a technical term. 

 

https://www.investopedia.com/terms/a/armslength.asp

 

 

risk 3 materialises. 

 

On 18/11/2017 at 22:34, davemclaren said:

I was merely articulating the risks as I see them. 

 

On 18/11/2017 at 10:32, davemclaren said:

Two possible risks I can see. The first is that this company isn’t capable of doing the work, though you would hope that the independent third party pm would do his due diligence on that. The second is that the independent third party pm wasn’t really independent and was influenced by Ann to help out a relative. 

 

Of course, there is actually a third risk of reputational damage in that people could look at this and then snidely try to infer that someting dodgy has happened. 

Dave you need to get a better handle on this retirement malarky :-)

 

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http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/our-region/edinburgh/hearts-announce-profit-of-2-3-million-1-4618219

 

Hearts have announced a profit of £2.3 million for the financial year ending June 2017 despite spending £6.9 million on the redevelopment of Tynecastle Park. The club have released their accounts to shareholders ahead of their 111th annual meeting on 11 December and the positive figures are owed largely to an ‘exceptional donation’ of £2.5 million from an unnamed benefactor, which was put towards the construction costs of the new main stand. There is a commitment to spend another £5.9 million and, with owner Ann Budge revealing that the project was expected to run over-budget, accounts show that Hearts have also secured a bank loan of £1.75 million which they can utilise if necessary. Supporters group Foundation of Hearts also contributed £1.5 million to the cost of the main stand in the last financial year. Hearts managed to increase turnover by £1.3 million, with season ticket sales being one of the main factors in the increase according to the report.

Read more at: http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/our-region/edinburgh/hearts-announce-profit-of-2-3-million-1-4618219

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MoncurMacdonaldMercer
2 hours ago, Spencer said:

Thanks for your kind remarks. 

 

There is nothing within the A/A's to suggest the loan was granted by a Bank. If that were the case it would most likely see the senior debt provider granted SS and B&FC over Tynecastle.  I don't see intimation of such within the A/A's 

 

I appreciate people raising questions isn't always popular 

 

if you were a proper hearts fan you would be too intoxicated with gratitude towards queen Ann to be asking any questions

 

also history has shown that blindly accepting the actions of decision makers is always the right thing to do

 

move on

 

 

 

 

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Fantastic news. It would be nice to know what the turnover is also, but nonetheless shows the financial health off the field which puts the club on good footing going forward.

 

Kinda begs the question, when that money is freed up to invest in the team what sorta team we could be looking at? Could be good.

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2 minutes ago, MoncurMacdonaldMercer said:

 

if you were a proper hearts fan you would be too intoxicated with gratitude towards queen Ann to be asking any questions

 

also history has shown that blindly accepting the actions of decision makers is always the right thing to do

 

move on

 

 

 

 

OK 

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8 minutes ago, Bainy said:

Excellent - offer it to Levein to resign.

Numerous threads to bash Levein yet you leave it for the one positive thread on here. Grow up 

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20 minutes ago, Trapper John McIntyre said:

The type of silly response I would expect from someone who clearly doesn't have a sense of humour and is up his own arse.

It is obvious that a decent set of accounts has brought out the worst in the club's critics.  It wasn't what they hoped for and now they're all at sea.

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Montgomery Brewster

Yes all good.

 

bearing in mind turnover will start increasing further once all the various lounges are all open in the main stand. 

 

 

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IveSeenTheLight
19 minutes ago, OTT said:

Fantastic news. It would be nice to know what the turnover is also, but nonetheless shows the financial health off the field which puts the club on good footing going forward.

 

Kinda begs the question, when that money is freed up to invest in the team what sorta team we could be looking at? Could be good.

 

It is quite interesting.

Excellent that you guys made £2.3M in profit, however it also says that is due to an exceptional donation of £2.5M

The quote above also mentioned the accounts showing a £1.75M loan which could be drawn down if required.

It looks like £6.9M of the stand was factored in potentially meaning with another £7M to be accounted in the stand for 2017/18, the profit and the FoH contributions will still be key to the accounts for next year.

 

Fantastic news, but looks like it reaffirms the message that you need to move on players before more can come in.

I don't see this as you have £2.3M available to invest in the squad

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Trapper John McIntyre
3 minutes ago, JamboAl said:

It is obvious that a decent set of accounts has brought out the worst in the club's critics.  It wasn't what they hoped for and now they're all at sea.

It is obvious you're still pondering whether to grass me up to the Mods.

 

You know, like you usually do with Spencer.

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We might be crap at football but Ann has made us a much better business & it’s still early doors. 

 

Once everything is in place we can hopefully get a team team to match the good work that’s been fine to set us up for the future. 

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6 minutes ago, IveSeenTheLight said:

 

It is quite interesting.

Excellent that you guys made £2.3M in profit, however it also says that is due to an exceptional donation of £2.5M

The quote above also mentioned the accounts showing a £1.75M loan which could be drawn down if required.

It looks like £6.9M of the stand was factored in potentially meaning with another £7M to be accounted in the stand for 2017/18, the profit and the FoH contributions will still be key to the accounts for next year.

 

Fantastic news, but looks like it reaffirms the message that you need to move on players before more can come in.

I don't see this as you have £2.3M available to invest in the squad

Has anybody said we have £2.3 million to invest in the squad???

only you that's mentioned it so feck off!!!!

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39 minutes ago, OTT said:

Kinda begs the question, when that money is freed up to invest in the team what sorta team we could be looking at? Could be good.

 

This. I am patient enough to see the bigger picture and as frustrating as we are to watch currently we will get there

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10 minutes ago, 1874robbo said:

Has anybody said we have £2.3 million to invest in the squad???

only you that's mentioned it so feck off!!!!

 

His obsession with us/here is creepy to say the least.

 

If you equalise the profit with the investment, we're still left with a huge chunk of cash (£6.9m) that we won't be needing to spend on a stand every year.

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17 minutes ago, Trapper John McIntyre said:

It is obvious you're still pondering whether to grass me up to the Mods.

 

You know, like you usually do with Spencer.

Have you lost interest in the topic?

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Trapper John McIntyre
Just now, JamboAl said:

Have you lost interest in the topic?

No, as long as you're on the thread it's got my attention.

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Footballfirst

Dear "CropleyWasGod" and other dot net watchers ...... If you are going to dissect Hearts accounts, the please give your follow readers a steer in the right direction about what is or isn't included.

 

CWG - you at least seem to have a modicum of intelligence with numbers.  Here's a couple of things to pass on to your followers:  

Hearts £2.578m income recorded as "UEFA solidarity and prize money" was not just Hearts Europa League income. It refers to three different things, Europa League income, the Solidarity payment and prize money from SPFL, and domestic competitions.

 

Can you also remind them that the FOH cash doesn't go through the Profit & Loss account, but is treated as an equity investment, just like HSL's share purchases.  Incidentally FOH currently holds the voting rights over 20% of Hearts shares (will go up to 35% in Apr/May 2018), despite not owning shares.  HSL has 11% of shares and voting rights.  

 

I'd also be happy to dissect the Hibs accounts if you can provide a copy, before they are published by Companies House in a few weeks time..

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13 minutes ago, Escobar PHM said:

£2.3 million PROFIT ? That's a very interesting slant to put on the accounts I must say.

 

Profit is profit! I'm sure we would have all been accepting of a loss given the fact we have just built a new main stand so fail to see this anything of than positive news

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20 minutes ago, Montgomery Brewster said:

Yes all good.

 

bearing in mind turnover will start increasing further once all the various lounges are all open in the main stand. 

 

 

 

The product on the park will need to improve before there's any noticeable increase in turnover through the extra capacity, new "premium seats" and extra lounges. I don't see any big rush for those selling anything more than last season the way things are at the moment on the pitch - especially going by the current trend of attendance figures from the last few fixtures!

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Romanov Stole My Pension

Things like the exceptional donation are really impressive and show that Budge is doing a great job in so many ways. It's a shame we're all having to concentrate so much on our poor performances. Hopefully we get back on track and we'll be able to appreciate the off-field matters more.

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Footballfirst
6 minutes ago, buzzbomb said:

How much do we still have to pay until we pay off the stand, pay Ann Budge back and then own the club..?

 

The £3m stand contribution will be paid off with April 2018's contribution (assuming the £125k a month is maintained).  The £2.4m loan and the £100k for the 75.1% shares should then be paid off in December 2019 at the same rate.

 

What is not known is the level of debt that FOH will inherit e.g. how much if any of the £1.75m will have been drawn down, repaid or outstanding.

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1 minute ago, Footballfirst said:

 

The stand contribution will be paid off with April's contribution (assuming the £125k a month is maintained).  The £2.4m loan and the £100k for the 75.1% shares should then be paid off in December 2019 at the same rate.

 

What is not know is the level of debt that FOH will inherit e.g. how much if any of the £1.75m will have been drawn down, repaid or outstanding.

So, are you saying by next April the stand will be paid for provided FoH DDs continue at the current rate..? And then all that remains to pay is Ann's initial loan, plus anything we use out of the £1.75M draw down..? That could put us in a decent position quite soon. Cheers.

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10 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

 

The £3m stand contribution will be paid off with April 2018's contribution (assuming the £125k a month is maintained).  The £2.4m loan and the £100k for the 75.1% shares should then be paid off in December 2019 at the same rate.

 

What is not known is the level of debt that FOH will inherit e.g. how much if any of the £1.75m will have been drawn down, repaid or outstanding.

Indeed. Or who the provider is.

 

It was rumoured a few years back that some guys originally from Edinburgh had made money in the City and were in HK more latterly. 

 

There are people out there with Hearts allegiance who are pretty wealthy 

 

 

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Dagger Is Back
4 hours ago, HoGwash said:

it is perfectly possible that Hearts obtained a better price than would normally be the case due to the family connection. There would also presumably be a built in element of trust between the 2 companies.

 

Indeed that may well have been a factor. I’m sure it’s a question that will be asked at the AGM

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43 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

Dear "CropleyWasGod" and other dot net watchers ...... If you are going to dissect Hearts accounts, the please give your follow readers a steer in the right direction about what is or isn't included.

 

CWG - you at least seem to have a modicum of intelligence with numbers.  Here's a couple of things to pass on to your followers:  

Hearts £2.578m income recorded as "UEFA solidarity and prize money" was not just Hearts Europa League income. It refers to three different things, Europa League income, the Solidarity payment and prize money from SPFL, and domestic competitions.

 

Can you also remind them that the FOH cash doesn't go through the Profit & Loss account, but is treated as an equity investment, just like HSL's share purchases.  Incidentally FOH currently holds the voting rights over 20% of Hearts shares (will go up to 35% in Apr/May 2018), despite not owning shares.  HSL has 11% of shares and voting rights.  

 

I'd also be happy to dissect the Hibs accounts if you can provide a copy, before they are published by Companies House in a few weeks time..

 

Anyone else got a man crush on FF?

 

Just me then...:laugh:

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Footballfirst
3 minutes ago, dallas said:

So a 200k loss?

 

If you want to put it that way, then yes, it is a £200k loss (but only after paying £3.7m plus the £2.5m donation towards building the new stand in the 12 month period)

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1 hour ago, Trapper John McIntyre said:

No, as long as you're on the thread it's got my attention.

Is that an admission of trolling?

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Comparing the financials released by us and Hibs in recent day’s clearly shows the gulf between the two clubs in terms of potential for the future. If ever there was a case of ‘mind the gap’ these results demonstrate it. 

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Trapper John McIntyre
20 minutes ago, JamboAl said:

Is that an admission of trolling?

Is that what you've been up to? Trolling me?

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Can i just check im reading this right that termination of contracts was £170k against £384k for CP.

 

So when we have been talking about the huge cost to pay out contracts it was, while not ideal, relatively small in comparison to what people assumed.

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1 hour ago, Footballfirst said:

Dear "CropleyWasGod" and other dot net watchers ...... If you are going to dissect Hearts accounts, the please give your follow readers a steer in the right direction about what is or isn't included.

 

CWG - you at least seem to have a modicum of intelligence with numbers.  Here's a couple of things to pass on to your followers:  

Hearts £2.578m income recorded as "UEFA solidarity and prize money" was not just Hearts Europa League income. It refers to three different things, Europa League income, the Solidarity payment and prize money from SPFL, and domestic competitions.

 

Can you also remind them that the FOH cash doesn't go through the Profit & Loss account, but is treated as an equity investment, just like HSL's share purchases.  Incidentally FOH currently holds the voting rights over 20% of Hearts shares (will go up to 35% in Apr/May 2018), despite not owning shares.  HSL has 11% of shares and voting rights.  

 

I'd also be happy to dissect the Hibs accounts if you can provide a copy, before they are published by Companies House in a few weeks time..

 

Top notch 

 

And great to see football fans helping each other

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21 minutes ago, soonbe110 said:

Comparing the financials released by us and Hibs in recent day’s clearly shows the gulf between the two clubs in terms of potential for the future. If ever there was a case of ‘mind the gap’ these results demonstrate it. 

 

Indeed, it is going to take time and patience but what a position we should be in come 2020. I don’t see any reason why FoH contributions will drop off either which could be an extremely valuable £1.4mil a year to the club

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I've not been a FOH member for a couple of years as I've been out the country. 

 

Rejoined today.

That's all.

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2 minutes ago, Sexton Hardcastle said:

Hibs post a loss. Financial doping or nah?

Was it not the vermin who accused us of living beyond our means hypocrites every last one

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5 hours ago, Spencer said:

That's a rather lazy article if I may say 

 

There is nothing to suggest any Bank has granted the facility in question 

 

Of course it might be the case, but they would require a SS and B&FC and neither is disclosed in A/A's 

 

Given the bath LBG took at hands of their last remaining exposure to Scottish Football I'd be amazed if any Bank is looking to engage in any debt provision to a Scottish Football Club.  Not least one which suffered an insolvency event 3 years ago thus shaking off c. £30M of obligations 

 

Be amazed!   

 

You have no idea of the decision making process and, I seriously doubt you are in the banking business, unless of course you are Fred Goodwin! 

 

You are talking through a very large wind tunnel in your bahoochie!

 

I really am sick to death of your constant nitpicking and ill-informed, no, UN-informed opinions.

 

I am following my son and various others I know and putting your drivel on ignore.

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5 hours ago, Sooperstar said:

That article has taken Hearts previous communication that they have finance available and assumed it is from a bank. That's all it is though, an assumption. Almost certainly an incorrect one at that.

 

How do you know that?

 

Your assumption! 

 

(You're not Spencer's sister are you???)

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1 minute ago, colinmaroon said:

 

Be amazed!   

 

You have no idea of the decision making process and, I seriously doubt you are in the banking business, unless of course you are Fred Goodwin! 

 

You are talking through a very large wind tunnel in your bahoochie!

 

I really am sick to death of your constant nitpicking and ill-informed, no, UN-informed opinions.

 

I am following my son and various others I know and putting your drivel on ignore.

You bash on fella and do what you need to do 

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