PUNT PUNT PUNT

[Caspian Primrose]

thought we might have seen the last of the aimless long balls when Danny Wilson left. Of all the gripes I've read on here recently this is the one that concerns me the most. i feel pretty positive about this season, I believe the longer the season goes the stronger we will get. However, I'm starting to think this style of play is accepted if not encouraged by our management team. I toil to watch football being played like that. What do you guys think? Will we be playing long balls from from the back for the foreseeable?

[Bazzas right boot]

Nah, can't agree.

 

We need to mix it up to keep opponents guessing, my biggest gripe is that we pass it too slow and short sometimes, when a more direct approach should be encouraged.

 

We are not a hit and hope team.

[i8hibsh]

We must've watched different games. We knocked it about.

[Caspian Primrose]

Nah, can't agree.

 

We need to mix it up to keep opponents guessing, my biggest gripe is that we pass it too slow and short sometimes, when a more direct approach should be encouraged.

 

We are not a hit and hope team.

Interesting. Your biggest gripe is exactly how I want us to play.

[Guest Bilel Mohsni]

Christ!

[RudiHMFC]

I must say i hate a punt. Noticed it in the first game of the season and gave the cheeks a puff, a long ball now and again is ok if it has a purpose but continuous punts are horrific.

[Coco]

I prefer it when Augustyn punts it ... less risk of us losing a goal than when he tries to pass it.

[Glottis]

Blazej likes a long pass but unlike Wilson his are usually in play and aimed towards a man.

 

We're a division up, we will punt it a bit more due to improved opposition but I still think our main game plan isn't long ball.

[jbee647]

We began last season by playing football out from the back, there were games when we had to mix it up - and rightly so

However this season, more often than not we resort to lumping it up the park

The reasons are obvious, teams are far better in this division, and secondly other than Walker and Nicholson (hopefully Swanson) we just don't have the players with good enough ability to get us up the park with any pace

 

 

 

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[Jambof3tornado]

Not enough crosses into boxes is my big gripe. Some of the best wingers/marauding full backs in the league but we hardly get any crosses into the box (especially today when we know how our opponents keeper handles cross balls).

[The Merse]

Pass it sideways at the back till we either lose possession or punt it.

 

Not really sure what we are trying to go tbh.

[Neil Jung]

thought we might have seen the last of the aimless long balls when Danny Wilson left. Of all the gripes I've read on here recently this is the one that concerns me the most. i feel pretty positive about this season, I believe the longer the season goes the stronger we will get. However, I'm starting to think this style of play is accepted if not encouraged by our management team. I toil to watch football being played like that. What do you guys think? Will we be playing long balls from from the back for the foreseeable?

Fully agree. Robbie keeps talking about our passing game however I don't see it. Too often the easy option of long hopeful ball is played which ends in nothing. We have no patience any more. Be brave...

[Caspian Primrose]

We began last season by playing football out from the back, there were games when we had to mix it up - and rightly so

However this season, more often than not we resort to lumping it up the park

The reasons are obvious, teams are far better in this division, and secondly other than Walker and Nicholson (hopefully Swanson) we just don't have the players with good enough ability to get us up the park with any pace

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Yes we are playing better opposition but our defenders (Augustyn, Ozturk and Paterson mostly), under no pressure whatsoever, with midfielders available for a short pass choose to hit longs balls anyway. Gomis and Pallardo are tremendous footballers, it saddens me to watch the ball fly over their heads. As for getting the ball up the park quickly, besides from counter attacks, what's the rush?

[Captain America]

I prefer it when Augustyn punts it ... less risk of us losing a goal than when he tries to pass it.

This.

[jbee647]

Gomis and Pallardo are skilful players, but are too slow at moving us up the park, granted they are both defensiv midfield players

Pace is paramount for any successful team these days

 

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[kila]

I prefer it when Augustyn punts it ... less risk of us losing a goal than when he tries to pass it.

 

Haha yes, my thoughts exactly.

[Jamboelite]

Thought there were a couple of cracking cross field passes to Nicholson.

 

An aimless punt isnt the same as a long pass.

[Walter Payton]

Even though I'd rather we had an effective passing game, I actually thought we didn't play accurate long balls enough today. The Killie defence (who didn't seem to have much pace between them) were playing an extremely high line for most of the 2nd half, almost on the half way line as they pushed for an equaliser. I thought we didn't do enough to exploit the pace of our wingers with balls in behind.

[Gorgiewave]

We either try and fail to pass from the back - which ends in risking losing possession and passes back to the ?keeper - or lumped balls.

 

I think our priority should be to get the ball to the halfway line. Then we can and pass through them.

[RS86]

Our winner v Killie in cup game was a direct result of a Paterson crossfield punt landing for Nicholson, just saying...

[Generic Username]

Word for word from the boy in front of me today;

 

"Get it up the park Hearts"

 

*ball gets launched up the park*

 

"What's the point in long balls?!"

 

MAKE YOUR MIND UP YOU MELT!

[Regular John]

We only really punt it or play long diagonals when we're pressed high, otherwise we tend to try to play it short from the back.

 

Scottish football doesn't normally accommodate a slow build up game, you're always pressed.

[The Future's Maroon]

thought we might have seen the last of the aimless long balls when Danny Wilson left. Of all the gripes I've read on here recently this is the one that concerns me the most. i feel pretty positive about this season, I believe the longer the season goes the stronger we will get. However, I'm starting to think this style of play is accepted if not encouraged by our management team. I toil to watch football being played like that. What do you guys think? Will we be playing long balls from from the back for the foreseeable?

 

Sorry, maybe you should have bought a ST for Barca/R Madrid etc.....its HMFC in the pissy Scottish league, apologies if Mr Messi didnt turn up.

[Statto]

I understand that we need to mix it up during a game, if we keep doing the same things, teams will work us out and prevent us from doing it.

 

I'd like to see us use our full backs going forward a lot more, we have 2 holding mids to cover for when they go forward, they're both athletic players will good ball control, Paterson has a great cross in him, haven't seen as much of Oshaniwa. We have a couple of tall strikers who will both be able to compete in the air with all Scottish Premier centre backs. Even if they don't get a shot at goal from their headers, you'll have Walker and Nicholson feeding off the second balls.

 

Another thing I wouldn't mind seeing is when Alexander has the ball in hand, I'd like to see the centre backs drift to the edge of either side of the box, the full backs push up and Gomis or Pallardo drop deep to collect the ball. There will always be an option, the opposition either leave a man free with a good shape for us to build on or they push high up the pitch and leave space in the midfield for Juanma or Sow to win the first ball.

[Dr Ian Malcolm]

The problem is tempo. When we move it quickly and have movement off the ball not many teams can live with it. Too often it takes an age for the ball to come from our own defensive third into midfielder, by which point we're hemmed in and have to go long. Sometimes that's due to extra unnecessary passes and sometimes it's a lack of options for whoever's in possession. Gomis and Prince in particular are guilty of dwelling on the ball and making daft short passes that take us nowhere. When Gomis moves it quickly or Prince drives forward is when we play well. Hasn't been happening often enough lately. Swanson ahead of them centrally might help.

 

 

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[Tiberius Stinkfinger]

Eh................

 

Eh................

 

Punt??? Is that how you spell it ??

[the Hearts way]

Can?t have it all ways.   For as long as I remember the mood of the Hearts fans is that they feel more at ease with route one stuff.    Probably goes back to the 80?s when it worked with Clark and Robbo.   The evidence of it comes when Hearts fans watch a team try to keep possession, esp if they make an error.    Just listen to how the crowd react.   You?ll hear lots of groans and quite a few calls to boot it up the park.

[the Hearts way]

I prefer it when Augustyn punts it ... less risk of us losing a goal than when he tries to pass it.

 

I'd prefer it if we can move him on asap.

[Debut 4]

If people think we are good enough to keep the ball on the deck all the time they are deluded.

 

Did some miss a lot of the fine play in the first half?

 

Some fine link up play with Nicholson and Walker yesterday and great feet and running from Sow.

 

The problem is we don't do it often enough in 90 minutes of football.

[Debut 4]

The problem is tempo. When we move it quickly and have movement off the ball not many teams can live with it. Too often it takes an age for the ball to come from our own defensive third into midfielder, by which point we're hemmed in and have to go long. Sometimes that's due to extra unnecessary passes and sometimes it's a lack of options for whoever's in possession. Gomis and Prince in particular are guilty of dwelling on the ball and making daft short passes that take us nowhere. When Gomis moves it quickly or Prince drives forward is when we play well. Hasn't been happening often enough lately. Swanson ahead of them centrally might help.

 

 

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i agree with this.

 

For all that i like Gomis he rarely sees a forward pass as his first thought.

 

It's always too safe (which in essence is fine) but when we need to be quicker, exploit space and do the crucial thing we simply don't do it often enough and we don't ask questions.

 

Rarely do we see him collect the ball, spin and knock a quick pass into the strikers.

[bighusref]

Wilson didn't punt the ball up. It's obvious that Wilson goes and we start to see an increase of punted balls.

[TDF01]

I must have been at a different game. There was lots of brilliant passing and movement - we didn't take our chances and should have won the game by half-time. The long ball was played occasionally - 2 amazing long balls in the 2nd half from Augustyn to Nicholson.

 

The only complaint I have was Sow being subbed. Sow and especially Nicholson were fantastic.

[oh ah grantona]

Word for word from the boy in front of me today;

 

"Get it up the park Hearts"

 

*ball gets launched up the park*

 

"What's the point in long balls?!"

 

MAKE YOUR MIND UP YOU MELT!

Get up the park is not punt it, Its move it up quicker 

 

we are 2 slow to move up we all used to moan at Barry the crab but a high percentage of our play is that side side side side 

[Generic Username]

Get up the park is not punt it, Its move it up quicker

 

we are 2 slow to move up we all used to moan at Barry the crab but a high percentage of our play is that side side side side

Every pass can't be a forward pass.

 

Some just refuse to buy into the idea of possession and recycling the play. If all we ever did was pass backwards then I could understand the frustrations but it's quite evident what we are doing when there's nothing on in front.

 

Some also just genuinely want the ball hoofed up to a big target man and for us to play for the second ball. Sack watching that for 90 minutes.

[Victorian]

We only really punt it or play long diagonals when we're pressed high, otherwise we tend to try to play it short from the back.

 

Scottish football doesn't normally accommodate a slow build up game, you're always pressed.

This is correct. I do hope that all moaning disaster cases take note and look out for this at the next game.

[Bazzas right boot]

Interesting. Your biggest gripe is exactly how I want us to play.

 

I like the style of play we try as well, my point was that it is too slow sometimes.

 

We are at our best when we are direct and fast, this is not a punt, just transferring from midfield to attack quicker.

 

We always try and play short, this season we have kept to that but go long sometimes, nothing wrong with that, we are a long way of a long ball team.

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

We've been punting the ball up the park since fairly early in the first division campaign - it's just that the 'we're lucky to have Robbie he'll be moving to barca soon' folk seem to have been blinded to it cos of the odd passing movement to score the 4th against your local tired and demoralised postman

 

was successful in the first division is/will be fairly successful in this league but let's try not to pretend we have/had some amazing passing philosophy - that's Robbie speak for I had much the best players in the first division and probably the 3rd best players at least in this division so we'll probably do pretty well irrespective of my 'philosophy'

[Romulus]

We've been punting the ball up the park since fairly early in the first division campaign - it's just that the 'we're lucky to have Robbie he'll be moving to barca soon' folk seem to have been blinded to it cos of the odd passing movement to score the 4th against your local tired and demoralised postman

 

was successful in the first division is/will be fairly successful in this league but let's try not to pretend we have/had some amazing passing philosophy - that's Robbie speak for I had much the best players in the first division and probably the 3rd best players at least in this division so we'll probably do pretty well irrespective of my 'philosophy'

 

Agree to an extent. Its awful to watch Augustyn punt long ball after long ball, fair enough 1 out of 10 or so worked but why are we doing this? It was the same with Wilson last season. We know that Sow isn't strong in the air and I feel sorry for Juanma having to deal with winning headers if he wants any service at all. We need to concentrate on build up so we can pass into the strikers feet as that's where Juanma and Sow can give the opposition problems. It should be easy to pass into a midfielder and generate space or out to a full back who can run with the ball or find another option. We have 2 fast full backs yet we don't seem to get them forward a lot. On Saturday Paterson lost the ball 3 or 4 times through long punts to nobody.

 

Would like us to play Pallardo and Gomis as our centre midfield pairing. I understand that Robbie plays Buaben because he is seen as more attacking but for me Buaben doesn't score enough goals, have enough shots or influence the game in an attacking enough manner. Play Pallardo and Gomis in front of the back 4 and allow the 2 wingers and 2 strikers to have a bit of freedom.

[Spellczech]

Punts mean that our players are not good enough at pinging the ball around. With Hearts it is usually because there is not enough effort to move off the ball and find space. Space is at a premium on a narrow ground like Tynecastle. One thing I've always noticed about Celtic teams is that they expect to dominate the park right up to the opponents penalty area. This comes from having a large home ground and multiple players who are confident in possession. Nothing bugs me more that the fans who get impatient and start whistling for a hoof. No player gets better by playing route one. It is just playing the law of averages.

[We_are_the_Hearts]

Punts mean that our players are not good enough at pinging the ball around. With Hearts it is usually because there is not enough effort to move off the ball and find space. Space is at a premium on a narrow ground like Tynecastle. One thing I've always noticed about Celtic teams is that they expect to dominate the park right up to the opponents penalty area. This comes from having a large home ground and multiple players who are confident in possession. Nothing bugs me more that the fans who get impatient and start whistling for a hoof. No player gets better by playing route one. It is just playing the law of averages.

The problem is the lack of purpose and pace we pass at. It needs to be sharp to move the opposition about. Ours can be so pedestrian that you will never move the oppo about or create gaps. Then a pass behind or poor control puts us under pressure.

[Romulus]

Punts mean that our players are not good enough at pinging the ball around. With Hearts it is usually because there is not enough effort to move off the ball and find space. Space is at a premium on a narrow ground like Tynecastle. One thing I've always noticed about Celtic teams is that they expect to dominate the park right up to the opponents penalty area. This comes from having a large home ground and multiple players who are confident in possession. Nothing bugs me more that the fans who get impatient and start whistling for a hoof. No player gets better by playing route one. It is just playing the law of averages.

 

Well said. Nothing wrong with playing it backwards if it means keeping the ball and moving it about patiently.

[Juan Rom?n Riquelme]

It ends up getting launched because there isn't a central midfielder good enough or composed enough in the team to take the ball off the centre halves in congested areas.

[Romulus]

It ends up getting launched because there isn't a central midfielder good enough or composed enough in the team to take the ball off the centre halves in congested areas.

Yes there is. We have 2 in Pallardo and Gomis it's just a shame they aren't paired together often. Gomis is brilliant at creating space in possession. Time for Buaben to have a spell out the team.

[Juan Rom?n Riquelme]

Yes there is. We have 2 in Pallardo and Gomis it's just a shame they aren't paired together often. Gomis is brilliant at creating space in possession. Time for Buaben to have a spell out the team.

 

Gomis was brilliant at it when he was playing against plumbers and bus drivers. He's average in this league.

 

Pallardo is a good player but he's not a playmaker.

[Caspian Primrose]

Punts mean that our players are not good enough at pinging the ball around. With Hearts it is usually because there is not enough effort to move off the ball and find space. Space is at a premium on a narrow ground like Tynecastle. One thing I've always noticed about Celtic teams is that they expect to dominate the park right up to the opponents penalty area. This comes from having a large home ground and multiple players who are confident in possession. Nothing bugs me more that the fans who get impatient and start whistling for a hoof. No player gets better by playing route one. It is just playing the law of averages.

Good post. Your second last sentence is a very good point. When you think about what the club is trying achieve as a whole. Our players won't reach their potential playing route one, it will make them less attractive to clubs in superior leagues.

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

Who played that punt for Sam to trap it on Saturday, pity he didn't finish it, cracking punt. One short one long they used to say. Not in the Guardiola household mind you

[Neil Jung]

Good post. Your second last sentence is a very good point. When you think about what the club is trying achieve as a whole. Our players won't reach their potential playing route one, it will make them less attractive to clubs in superior leagues.

Also playing route one doesn't help the national standard. Most other countries have improved but we lag behind now due to the get intae thum and hoof it mentality.

[Caspian Primrose]

Who played that punt for Sam to trap it on Saturday, pity he didn't finish it, cracking punt. One short one long they used to say. Not in the Guardiola household mind you

Think it was Augustyn. Sure it wasn't from open play either, could be wrong. His 15 other attempts came to nothing unfortunately.

[Jambokirky]

When teams press us high we sometimes have no option to go long. The game on Saturday in the last 10 mins was crying out for Paterson to go up top. Should never have taken sow off but when we did it should of been McGhee on and Paterson moved up top.

[EreWeG0..]

Replace the 'P's with 'C's in the title and this thread can be recycled when Collum refs us next.