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Europa qualifiers


h-e-a-r-t-s

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I'm afraid you just need to look back to Dunfermline 2004. Worse than that Falkirk losing to Vaduz from Liechtenstein in 2009 (though they have beaten quite a few teams since then)

Yip, I was at their 'home' game , played at St. Johnstone cos of the plastic pitch. They were strolling the game and then lost 2 goals in the last few minutes to somehow lose the tie

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oh ah grantona

We are currently ranked 23 and looking at the way point work I could be completely wrong ( based on 90mins not sure if uefa are same)

 

Aberdeen 3.5 points won so far

Celtic. 2 points won so far

Motherwell 1 point won ( if done over ET Then well lose 0.5)

St Johnstone 1 point won so far ( saints gain 0.5 if ET+pens)

 

That's a total of 7.5 points but one site is showing this season gain as 1.75 and uefa showing 0

Uefa state they take points gained and then divide it by number of teams in Europe so that makes 0.25 no wonder we get sod all in Europe

 

15th place currently gets 2 champs league and 3 uefa cup spots 25 something points we are only at 15 points

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Allowayjambo1874

 

We are currently ranked 23 and looking at the way point work I could b completely wrong ( based on 90mins not sure if uefa are same)

 

Aberdeen 3.5 points won so far

Celtic. 2 points won so far

Motherwell 1 point won ( if done over ET Then well lose 0.5)

St Johnstone 1 point won so far ( saints gain 0.5 if ET+pens)

 

That's a total of 7.5 points but one site is showing this season gain as 1.75 and uefa showing 0

Uefa state they take points gained and then divide it by number of teams in Europe so that makes 0.25 no wonder we get sod all in Europe

 

15th place currently gets 2 champs league and 3 uefa cup spots 25 something points we are only at 15 points

 

I could be wrong but I thought qualifiers 'points' were weighted and you got a fraction of the points?

 

The four teams above scotland in coefficient table are sweden, croatia, poland and belarus. The last two have had one team knocked out of europe so far other than that all teams have qualified. Obviously that is same as scotland. Off the four countries below us, serbia only have a champ league representitive left, slovakia are same as us, norway have lost two out of four europas and their champ league, bulgaria only have champ league team left and hungary have lost two europas so far.

 

Long winded way of saying we are probably exactly where we are expected to be.

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IF you don't want to read this long post with numbers by a non-native English speaker go to the end and read the summary.

 

Far more important than country coefficient is team coefficient. The team coefficient determines who gets seeded in the draw. And that's really the secret ingredient of the recipe "How to reach the group stages", IMO. Because of the low country coeff. Celtic must start low (in the second round), but thanks to the high team coeff. Celtic is always seeded, and has an easy route to the group stages. So, the team coefficient is really the important one. Everybody earns its own team coefficient in Europe, so who cares about the results of the other Scottish clubs in Europe, they can't help Hearts' team coefficient, they are not contributing to the important coefficient, right?

 

WRONG.

 

 

Hearts currently has team coefficient of 6.130 for the 2015/16 European season (the earliest one Hearts can compete in, by winning Scottish cup in this season). 0.3500 points were added to this coefficient by the results of Scottish clubs in this season. So, in truth, OTHER SCOTTISH CLUB'S RESULTS ADD TO INDIVIDUAL TEAM COEFFICIENT.

 

Here's the breakdown of 6.130 coefficient points (the last five seasons are counted):

2010/11 0.7200

2011/12 2.0500 (1.5000 + 0.5500)

2012/13 2.3600 (1.5000 + 0.8600)

2013/14 0.6500

2014/15 0.3500+

TOTAL 6.130

 

NOTES:

* The bolded points are from the seasons Hearts competed in Europe, they are obviously the highest ones. In those two seasons: the first number in parenthesis are points earned by Hearts alone, and the second are points earned by all Scottish clubs together.

* The points earned by other Scottish clubs are small compared to how much you can earn yourself, but still have some worth.

* 0.3500 points for the 2014/2015 its obviously not the final number yet. Every win or draw of Scottish clubs will add to it.

 

 

SUMMARY

 

To reach the group stages in UEFA competitions (that's where the money is), the most important thing is to be seeded in as many qualification draws as possible.

Team coefficient determines if the club is seeded or not.

Each clubs contributes to its own team coefficient, BUT every single Scottish club contributes (in a smaller amount) to the team coefficient of other Scottish clubs, too.

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Only by qualifying for Europe every year will Hearts have a chance of a seeding in Europa League QR3 let alone QR4. It's years away..

 

+ there are changes in Europa League qualies next season. Here's the provisional access list -

 

http://kassiesa.net/uefafiles/2015-16-uefa-access-list.pdf

 

2 Scottish clubs enter in QR1 and it will be like that till Scotland are at least up to 17th in the rankings.

 

Also, as from next season - Cup runners up will not get entry if cup winners are already qualified. Highest league placing will.

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oh ah grantona

 

 

 

 

I could be wrong but I thought qualifiers 'points' were weighted and you got a fraction of the points?

 

The four teams above scotland in coefficient table are sweden, croatia, poland and belarus. The last two have had one team knocked out of europe so far other than that all teams have qualified. Obviously that is same as scotland. Off the four countries below us, serbia only have a champ league representitive left, slovakia are same as us, norway have lost two out of four europas and their champ league, bulgaria only have champ league team left and hungary have lost two europas so far.

 

Long winded way of saying we are probably exactly where we are expected to be.

 

You are correct uefa say its 2 points for a win and 1 for a draw

Points halved in qualifying and playoff round

 

You get 4 points for group stage of champs league (so England have 12 points already)

And an extra point per round from last 16 I think in both comps

 

All it takes for teams like us is a bit of luck, st johnsstone done excellent and really are not playing household names, a good draw in playoff round and your in the groups. We ourselves were unlucky against Liverpool who were cold and not taking us as serious opposition. Basically we need to be on the ball and top form to make it.

 

Look at Aberdeen facing a Dutch side tricky tie and now a Spanish side( beatable but need to bring something back) then they might end up facing a hot pot again.

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Has Spleedoink calmed down from his St Johnstone/Aberdeen/Besiktas seethe-fest or has Aberdeen's victory pushed him into a breakdown?

 

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

 

If St Johnstone beat Spartak Trnava in the next round I fear for every kitten and puppy in Scotland.

 

:sob:

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Lord Beni of Gorgie

ScottisScoot

Has Spleedoink calmed down from his St Johnstone/Aberdeen/Besiktas seethe-fest or has Aberdeen's victory pushed him into a breakdown?

 

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

 

If St Johnstone beat Spartak Trnava in the next round I fear for every kitten and puppy in Scotland.

 

:sob:

Scottish clubs in Europe has become the most worthless pursuit. We were lucky to get 2 glamour ties and then to push Liverpool so hard. Generally though, its now about hacking round Northern Europe to get pumped by the 5th best team in one of the "posh" leagues. Well done to both Aberdeen and St Johnstone for coming through ties I thought they would lose, the new formats have made the earlier rounds seem tarnished somewhat, unless you get to the group stage, the whole thing seems futile. Getting to the groups is now well nigh impossible for Scottish clubs, at least until we have very talented youngsters in bulk. On another note, fair play to McInnes pre match last night. He noted there was only 1 away ground they didn't win at last season, very pleasing!

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I'm afraid you just need to look back to Dunfermline 2004. Worse than that Falkirk losing to Vaduz from Liechtenstein in 2009 (though they have beaten quite a few teams since then)

 

The Dunfermline result was hopeless. Did Motherwell not lose to Mypa 47 a few years back as well which was chronic.

 

That said was the Falkirk one that bad a result? Obviously it wasn't great, but weren't Vaduz playing in the Swiss top flight at that point?

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Randy Marsh

Yes Vaduz are professional and play in the Swiss top league but qualify every year by winning the Liechtenstein cup. I would imagine they have as high a wage bill as most SPL teams. That Falkirk result is not as bad as it sounds.

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The Treasurer

In a way it's a pity St J and the sheep got through.

I always look forward to the annual "in-depth" analysis in the Sunday papers about :

where Scottish football has gone wrong, we need summer football, we have to go back to grass roots, it's the lack of facilities for kids, etc etc

that we get once all out teams have been humped out of Europe before the season has started

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Were there any live updates/ live texts on the BBC site for any of the games last night?

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Were there any live updates/ live texts on the BBC site for any of the games last night?

 

Yes, there were, interspersed with Commie Games stuff.

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SUMMARY

 

To reach the group stages in UEFA competitions (that's where the money is), the most important thing is to be seeded in as many qualification draws as possible.

Team coefficient determines if the club is seeded or not.

Each clubs contributes to its own team coefficient, BUT every single Scottish club contributes (in a smaller amount) to the team coefficient of other Scottish clubs, too.

 

Cheers, Justaguest - very enlightening.

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Isn't that lovely.....St Mirren have agreed to a postponement of their game against the sheep at Aberdeen at the request of the aformentioned wooly ones.

Was due to take place on the 16th Aug....9 days after the sheep could be bounced out of the Europa League.

What a lovely story!

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Alan Johnson

Aberdeen away to Sociedad tonight and St Johnstone at home to Trnava, either of them got a chance of going through? Good result tonight and the Saints should do it IMO.

 

Also Hull City away to Trencin of Slovakia.

 

Sent from my GT-I9195 using Tapatalk 2

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Aberdeen v Real Sociedad is live on Premier Sports on Thursday night.

 

Never mind!

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Any games on TV tonight?

Never mind me too.

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Have to hope st johnstone do well surely we have a stronger league than slovakia? No disrespect to trnava but i'd hope they could win that game

 

 

As for the sheep

Living dangerously the quality of sociedad is abundantly clear

 

 

Also up front for Real Sociedad is a chap i played against 15 years ago, Alfred Finnboggasson.

Played for Hutchie Vale and scored 10 of the 16 they scored against us. Set up the other six! :sad:

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Also up front for Real Sociedad is a chap i played against 15 years ago, Alfred Finnboggasson.

Played for Hutchie Vale and scored 10 of the 16 they scored against us. Set up the other six! :(

 

53 goals in 64 games for Heerenveen, according to Wikipedia. That's New Star Soccer-esque.

 

And this: Born in Grindav?k, Alfre? played for Grindav?k youth teams while also spending two years of his childhood in the Scottish capital Edinburgh while his father studied in the city.[4] Alfre? played for boys' club Hutchison Vale and became a fan of Hibernian.[4]

 

 

Boooooo.

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Motherwell's conquerers Stjarnan beating Lech Poznan 1-0, huge result if they hold on.

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FINK OV THE COEFFISHUNT

 

Love Euro trips....will become a wee bit more difficult every time our teams get pumped oot early doors.

It DOES affect us.

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Lord Beni of Gorgie

Scottish teams in Europe is like a broken pencil...............pointless

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Well done the 'Dad'

:argue:

 

Besiktas won 2-1 versus Feyenoord yesterday mate.

 

Bad days for you I'm afraid.

 

:(

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St Johnstone were very poor tonight. Their tight management of money is starting to show as they really need new players, but can't/won't sign any.

 

 

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For the few remaining UEFA co-efficient watchers, tonight's results drop Scotland down one place to 24th, which means all three Europa League entrants in 2016/17 will start in Qualifying round 1 unless things change unexpectedly in the second legs.

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Sierra Delta

For the few remaining UEFA co-efficient watchers, tonight's results drop Scotland down one place to 24th, which means all three Europa League entrants in 2016/17 will start in Qualifying round 1 unless things change unexpectedly in the second legs.

That's grim. What a mess Scottish football is.

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Aberdeen and St Johnstone to go through would be nice, but I'm not expecting anything from either.

 

Stevie May back for St J, massive boost for them.

 

Both to lose without much of a fight is my guess.

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